As an NZ resident, I am morally obliged to point out that Australia is a horrible place populated by criminals and terrible rugby teams, but I did live there for two years and in reality, it's not actually that bad.

Yes, their government are a shower of complete dickheads both in their own right and in the fact that they have their collective head shoved so far up Americas arse they can practically see the back of uncle sams tonsils. The immigration policy is pretty much barbaric and they seem hellbent on ruining the country as fast as humanly possible. And I haven't even gotten started on how unbelievably racist the country as a whole is (this is a country that only got rid of it's "White Australia Policy" in the 70s).

Border security, while they can be complete arseholes are not nearly as bad as they're portrayed on those TV shows. They do have a lot of idiots flouting the biosecurity laws (Johnny Depp is the least of their problems), but in general as long as you don't make the mistake of not being white, they're far more interested in any fruit you might have than any bills with coke on them. (side note: don't bring cash to Australia, almost every transaction is electronic there).

But the country itself has some great things going for it. Some of the scenery is amazing, the parts of the reef that aren't bleached are stunning, the food in the cities is amazing (as is the coffee, especially in Melbourne and Sydney).

EDIT: I answered my own question about this. Apparently "US Citizens Living Abroad" is one of the exemptions to the mandate/rule. So nevermind the below.

As a US citizen living outside the US, one thing that concerns me is the health care / insurance mandate and penalties.

I live in Thailand, and have health insurance through the nearly-universal Thai healthcare system because I have a job that pays in to it. On top of that, I have insurance through a private insurer based in the UK.

The Thai system is really good. A few years ago, I had something like 5 episodes of tonsillitis in one year, and my doc told me that I should consider getting a tonsillectomy. I opted to go for it, and the Thai govt. insurance paid for the entire operation except for about $30 that I had to pay myself because I opted to stay in a private, air conditioned room for a recovery night instead of the busy public ward. Other than that, it cost me absolutely nothing.

The private insurer I have is for any travel outside Thailand and backup purposes; it has a higher max payout and would allow for more optional treatments to major things. I haven't made any claims against it so far, but it is a nice safety net. The only downside to it is that it works "around the world*" (*except in the US, because that system is so f*&^ed up they wash their hands of it). So, on the rare occasions where I make a trip back home to the US, I'm technically uninsured.

Signing up for Obamacare would be pretty pointless for me. I've been in Thailand for about 10 years, and during that time I've been back to the US only twice for a sum total of about a month and a half. But technically, it seems that I may be subject to penalties since I don't have any US insurance coverage. No idea if there are exceptions for expats or not.

I think it's because Quebec has a shortage of doctors because Quebec in it's infinite stupidity and xenophobia do not allow doctors to practice unless they speak high level french (the same reason I can't get Permanent Residency here while other Aussie friends in BC and Ontario had no issue). I guess we simply didn't have a serious shortage in Australia. It's so easy to find a GP, I guess it might be harder to find one that Bulk Bills (medicare takes the entire cost of consultation) for low income earners.

My experience at hospitals is limited. When i got hit on the head by a cricket bat, i had to wait 2 hours, I think (was a long time ago), to get stitches. And when I had my tonsils out, I had to wait 6 months for the elective surgery because we didn't have private insurance.

My girlfriend had to go to the ER when she had mono here, we had to wait an hour or two before she was seen by a doctor. While we were there, the hospital was fucking decrepit, the waiting room was freezing (there was a lady who had a broken arm and she was violently shivering), and nearer the end of the day (my GF had to have an IV drip so we had to wait around there all day to see if it helped her) an old lady was called up and as she was walking past she said she had been there since 8 in the morning and they had literally forgotten about her.

One of my friends has an issue with kidney stones, they build up and he has to have surgery to get them out. He had a procedure booked for I don't know how long, went to the hospital and they told him they didn't have any beds left and he had to wait another week.

The Jewish General has now been instructed to turn away off-island patients. It has the best cancer treatment facility of any hospital, so people with cancer are now instructed to kindly fuck off.

The new, mega hospital in Vendome is waaaay over budget and time, and people (particularly old people) can't even get to it from the metro station right near it!

I'd love to move to Vancouver...

Tonsil hockey?

i have transcribed what i could from the FreeStyle portion of the night:

-----------------
when im walkin down (___ and ___) // telegraph?
____ these niggas doin me

then i walk up in the oracle
hear pussy niggas booin me

but when im in the back they love me like an israeli
its like niggas be jewin me

and yo girl got my penis in her mouth
like she bubble gum chewin me

im sick with it motherfucka
like E40
I got the flu in me

I get new money
from new dummies
its like i got new in me

and these niggas got the nerve to boo the savior
boo christ
the son of god
it dont really matter
they can boo me twice
im twice as hard

you might as well give me 20 nigga
thats how much the album costs
fuck boy
but i bet if you can walk to your car
i can show your bitch a dick she'll enjoy

so why dont you take your pussy ass on over there nigga
before i fuckin catch ya
or you can pull your bank out and ill match ya

but you aint gonna do shit but get punched in the face
old san francisco 49er ass faggot ass nigga
get outta here you not a lion in this race

im gonna freestyle these niggas
mestyle these niggas
im katt williams the gangsta
ill g style these niggas

i dont need no music
i can do it
A-capulco

and if a nigga say fuck me
i hit em with a fuck you too

i dont give a fuck

i brought john witherspoon
and i got three bad bitches
waitin at the waterfront
at my hotel room

so if you dont like me
and you think im stuntin
come get yo pussy ass whooped
outside by a statue of jack london

or... or

i can find one of them bitches
that i rescued from the track
and have her slice yo pussy ass neck
and leave you on the railroad track

it dont really matter to me
i dont give a fuck

i roll with G O D and the nation
if you dont like me
catch me eatin a cherry pie
cause its seasonal at nations

fuck these niggas
im the boss
i got so much sauce
im heavier than ross

i dont give a fuck
ask yo bitch
i bet she know me
i bet that bitch
can suck my dick outside of yoshis

huh... yea
fuck what these niggas talkin bout
no no, no no, i dont wanna hear it
if you wanna tell me,
catch me while im walkin like barry

naw naw naw naw
i know
you paid for a some laughs
ha ha ha ha ha
get on your cell phone
tell em meet you at telegraph

get it? cell phone telegraph.. its the same thing..anyway

im too good
white people dont like me
im too hood
bitches love me
im so wood..yea
lesbians love me
eat pussy so good

hey..dont worry..dont worry
be happy
they said they didnt like my hair when its permed
now they dont like it when its nappy

no, but it was flat in pimp chronicles,
they was talkin shit
now the shit look like the joker and riddler
and its only loved by your bitch

its so sad
so sad
they put in me in cuffs
and they so mad
so mad

but i swear, i dont give a fuck about a penis
cause katt williams is from mars, same as women
fuck penis

love yall forever
always will
i dont give a fuck who dont like me
thats what make me real

im not trying to be something
this is all im is

if you dont be-lask me
ask the niggas i fuck with
the bitches i fuck
and my motherfuckin kids

i done done seven specials
richard pryor only did two
eddie murphy did two
which is bigger seven or two?
same for me
same for you
huh huh huh huh huh


george carlin died before
katt williams did fo'
and then did three mo

katt williams live
its pimpin pimpin
pimp chronicles

got my mother fuckin dick in your bitches tonsils
hahahaha ha
i look like im young
im 43 nigga
get fucked by a fossil

the bitches that follow me are not ho's
they're my mother fuckin apostles
they're my disciples
i tell that bitch straight to the cross
ill knife ya

go to jail for a nigga my bitch
ill write ya

First time you see a good batch of tonsil stones, it looks like they have some sort of mouth cancer.

Like boogers for your mouth, they are pretty disgusting IMO. That girl had some huge suckers too, I'm shocked they didn't bug the hell out of her..it's like something being constantly stuck in your throat.

Huh? Your manipulating what I said pretty good, without addressing the points of comparison. And yet, you probably misunderstood, which doesn't make you a troll. I, however, am getting sick of this "My opponent is just a troll" bullshit" everyone uses instead of arguing their points on merit.

A majority of white women in PA and OH think black men are disgusting. Most rich women think poor men are disgusting and lazy. Some women are dumb bitches who are totally self-centered and spoiled, so what is your point?

I questioned your reason; not compared female circumcision with male circumcision (Although the comparison is far more equatable than you think. But your a man, so you wouldn't understand... *I am a man too...) I could say, "How dare you compare tonsils directly to circumcision!?" Of course, you did not compare the two, did you? Neither did I! So please stop accusing me.

Your line of apparent reason was "It shouldn't scar the child/adult, so why worry?" And I responded, "neither does a lot of shit. So what is the reasoning behind the defense?"

My point is that your defense is irrational and does not apply.

The American Medical Association is against circumcisions. I am too

BTW, I've had my tonsils removed, and I had sex before the age of consent, so I hope you won't think my opinion is too biased. All I was trying to point out in that link is that there are, at very least, scientific and moral arguments to be made. Had I known that the author was a Jew, I would've reported him immediately.

It's too bad I lost some respect points hp, as I respect you as well. I'm not saying that I have a lock on whether circumcision provides that many benefits, but I think that to say there is no medical or ethical argument is going a little too far. This debate has been going on for a long time. I definitely see why some people choose to keep their kids uncircumcised and I think the fact that so many people find the uncircumcised penis disturbing is disgusting. Hopefully that perception will change, and it's certainly not something that influenced my decision, neither was religion. One of the most intelligent people I know is uncircumcised and we had a long discussion about it prior to my son being born. In the end, it was the talk that I mentioned above with my mother in law that influenced me over to this side. She had seen instances of medical problems that could have been avoided by circumcision, and for right or wrong her practical experience is what I chose to go with. I could even be wrong. I'm willing to accept that, had I seen a video like this before I made my decision, it might have influenced me the other way.

One thing I'm sure of is that what I did to my son is not child abuse. It caused him no pain at all. And I'll be sure to explain to him when he's old enough that some people are circumcised and some aren't. I don't think he'll go through any real image issues, just as I never have with my circumcision. As for the idea that circumcision lessens sexual pleasure, there are actual studies with results that show that it does and results that show that it doesn't. Without going into detail, I can assure you that my own sexual appetite is quite prolific.

And another thing, anyone that compares male circumcision done in a hospital by a trained professional, to the removal of the clitoris by any means is clearly misrepresenting the issues. The first is done for (granted) perceived health benefits while the second is done to completely eliminate the sexual pleasure of the girl involved. That's the real difference between the two, even if you overlook the fact that the removal of a girl's clitoris is often performed in an unsanitary environment, by an unsanitary witchdoctor with an even more unsanitary piece of broken glass, or a razor-blade. If anyone were ever to ask me if I wanted to eliminate my son's ability to experience sexual pleasure for whatever reason, I would say no. And I think that difference is pretty obvious.

Saying that circumcision is akin to cutting off toes is ridiculous.

>> ^Ryjkyj:

>> ^hpqp:
@apologists: you have NO ethical nor medical arguments on your side

Pfft...
It seems your opinion was considered very popular back in 1971. I had no idea.
http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/118/1/385.full


Did you read the part about cultural bias? The article you linked starts off promisingly:

"The American public remains resolute in its support of newborn circumcision despite negative recommendations from the American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP)." Oh, so if the majority wants it...

The writer of the article: Edgar Schoen, Jew, maintainer of medicirc.org and member of the "Hill of Foreskins" society (Gilgal society). Noooo bias whatsoever there.


As for the actual "medical benefits" of circumcision, give me a f*cking break. "Prevents phimosis"? That's exactly like saying removing your toes prevents ingrown toenails. Phimosis is not only rare, but usually easily cured, as are most cases of UTI (btw, all the other fancy names that follow phimosis in the article are variations of the same thing). No need for mutilating your baby.


The most horrible and aberrant argument is the one concerning STDs and HIV... seriously, wtf?

Kids should not be having sex before the age of consent*; argument null!

(*that includes not being sucked off by some herpes-infested mohel.)



After that, it comes down to three things: hygiene, condoms and choice. Personal choice, not parental or communal pressure.

If it's all about prevention (a big effing lie), why not take out their tonsils? Or appendix? Or cut off the earlobes? Why not sterilize anyone who already has HIV? See where this goes?

Equating this with female circumcision is just irresponsible. Calling it mutilation is sensationalist, at best. Equating it with a sex change ? Troll.

Modern male circumcision by a qualified doctor is no more dangerous/necessary than getting your tonsils taken out. If you are arguing outside of the aesthetics or practicality, I don't have time for you.

And at the end of the day, the vast majority of women I've met think uncircumcised weiners are gross. That tips the scales considerably, IMO (YRMV).

I'M THOORRRRRR!

Even though I'm 6'3", over 300 lbs, I have a badly infected tonsil atm, so I TOTALLY sound like that.

Well if you didn't think the appendix was dumb, what about tonsils, your adenoids? They screw up ALL the time.

I always love that Mark Twain quote. I swear if there was a time traveler, Twain comes close as his insights are very good. Although, he could be very vitriolic.

>> ^NicoleBee:

2:40: AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA


Ya, I almost lost it there. I have to stop this before I hurl.

Re: ^ Laura

Yes, it seems excessive and it would be criminal/malpractice in the USA.

However, "Most things they end up taking the tonsils out for can be cured with antibiotics" is entirely false (not to mention dangerous to claim)

@SDGundamX

I think, perhaps, you interpreted the statement "authority" differently than it was meant. By authority, I believe he means someone taking a position of certainty without needing any external justification/confirmation. Whereas science is based on only taking positions which can be supported through observation, confirmation, reason, etc... In this sense, science is NOT based on authority.

Science is a self corrective system - like you point out with your tonsils story, its views and opinions shift and change with the changes in available data. And this data is incoming faster and faster, as technology improves, which improves our ability to turnaround improvements (maybe it won't take 30 yrs to make such improvements, anymore). So your tonsils story is a good piece of punctuation for Hawking's point about religion being based on authority, while science is based on observation and reason.

As for what "win" means - I think it merely means whenever there is a conflict between science and the popular religion of the day, science will win out. We saw it with the flat earth vs round, we're seeing it with evolution. It's likely we'll continue to see more clashes in the future, until religion either dies out or popular religion becomes much less rigid than the major religions we have today.