Don't Kill Tyrion - a song for George R.R. Martin (GoT) has been added as a related post - related requested by ChaosEngine on that post.

Blame presumes guilt. There's no guilt in voting for your interests, even if others don't understand them.

Reasons for those voting decisions are interesting, but also very hard to get since the media ignores everything between the coasts, and even the diverse internet is so full of filter bubbles that you're basically funneled straight into echo chambers. At least on my end, the Silicon Valley/Hollywood culture is drowning out everything else -- and I'm a commie outsider who doesn't give a shit about celebrities or "save zones".

That said, the election is just the most recent culmination of an ongoing, decades-long development. But that's beyond the point, so...

Populism trumps business as usual if business as usual leads to Detroit, Cleveland and Camden. Or the rural areas on the coast of Louisiana, which were hit much harder than New Orleans and still look worse than Chernobyl, 11 years after the fact.

So the question is: did you a) fail to provide an alternative, b) fail to make a convincing case for that alternative, c) decide against trying to convince those that think differently, or d) not even realize that not everybody shares your perception of reality.

Given the tone of the reactions, the collective damnation of Trump voters as (insert any insult in the book), I'm thinking that d) is a much bigger issue than anyone is willing to admit.

In short, I blame George R. R. Martin. If he had published The Winds of Winter by now, all would be well.

My reaction was: "Okay, that's it. I'm done with this show. I'll never watch Game of Thrones again and I'll never read the books, because the plot has gotten too repetitive and therefore extremely annoying!¹ It continuously uses the same pattern over and over again. Why should I bother watching the show if I know that every interesting and/or likable character (except Tyrion) will face certain death at the next best opportunity (George R.R. Martin said so himself, but I didn't expect him to do this every damn time) just as a means to shock the audience/readership and an attempt to make the plot seem unpredictable. But you know what? If you kill off the most likable and interesting character(s) every season/novel, this is very predictable. It's just lazy and unimaginative storytelling."

That's why I had already expected this to happen, although I really hoped it wouldn't, not only because I liked the character, but because this pattern is really starting to get old. Therefore, I just found it severely annoying, since it seemed so predictable and repetitive. However, I have come to terms with this outcome since then and I'll most probably keep watching the show, but I may never get invested in any character's fate again, because it can be easily predicted.

¹I'm not usually one to stop watching a show for any reason, except if it's really badly written and executed, and even then I give it at least several episodes to make up my mind. So I'm not one of those who say "If [insert character name] dies, I'll stop watching the show."

George R.R. Martin himself describes Maurice Druon's series "The accursed kings (Les Rois maudits)" as being "The Original Game of Thrones".

http://www.georgerrmartin.com/maurice-druons-the-iron-king/

@mentality

You can enjoy the series if you like. I'm sure you have your reasons. I merely gave the reasons why I think it's a poorly written series. You can't dispute that, unless you claim I am not allowed to have my own opinions (which from what I can see are supported by many, many ex-George R. R. Martin fans).

I don't, and I am far from alone in my feelings toward the series. Every GoT booster says the same things as you. Problem is, it's a load. I read plenty of atypical fantasy, most of which I really enjoy. I stopped reading GoT when I realized it wasn't fun to read anymore.

Oh, and all the characters you mention either sucked IMO or were inaccessibly stupid, cruel, or annoying.

Pretending that it's good, because it's not enjoyable, is just pretentious by the way.

I think George R. R. Martin has the world's most severe case of ADD.

I read the first three books in the series, and there are a ton of awesome ideas, but it feels like as soon as you get behind a character to cheer for them, they die. The murdered lord's children all get dire wolves as pets in the beginning, and I'm thinking, cool, that's going somewhere, but nada. Some of the wolves die, others run away. You never hear from them again.

The whole series is like that, completely unhinged. I don't know how it's so popular, or why it was made into a TV series. Maybe just the unpredictability of it, there's certainly no other reason to follow the series.

I understand that there are time concerns with a televised series, but I felt like there was a lot in this battle/episode that I missed in comparison to the book.

I've read that George R. R. Martin is a fan of the Chinese historical novel "Romance of the Three Kingdoms" (I'm a fan also), and to me it seems pretty clear that the Battle of the Blackwater was fairly strongly inspired by the Battle of Red Cliff (Chi Bi) from that book.

Both have a long lead-up to a known naval battle, led by very intelligent strategists (Tyrion in GoT, Zhuge Liang in RoTK) coming up with a strategy that involves clustering/connecting the boats with a chain/chains and then hitting them with fire. The nuances present in the telling of both of these battles in their respective books are great, and although I personally think that the GoT version was partially inspired by RoTK, Martin did a good job of putting his own spin on it and making it his own.

The TV version was still entertaining for me, but I kept on thinking about what was missing that makes the characters (particularly Tyrion) shine even more. It also seemed that everything happens so fast that it would likely be fairly confusing to viewers who haven't read the book also.

Anyone coming from a TV perspective only have a take on that? Or is anyone familiar with RoTK and see the shadows of it come through in Game of Thrones like I do?

*promote Let us try a morning promote. This of course being the well-used song for the second season trailer in HBO's, George R.R. Martin, Game of Thrones (off to the right currently--early March of 2012).

XX--XXOh and if anyone can see the Amazon store entries I put in, tell me, for now I'm assuming it's messed up or not getting along with my sift. (Actually I did just find it, a bit odd, it just showed up in my homepage moments ago--so I'll have to see what else I may need to do for them.)

>> ^eventualentropy:

Warning: Riddled with spoilers despite their claim otherwise


Thanks for the heads-up. I was just wondering whether to go ahead and watch this, since I'm going to buy all 4 books in a couple of weeks.

*edit* Lilithia - it would be awesome if you included a SPOILER ALERT somewhere high up in the video description and/or the tags!

I miss Firefly. I think this is when I started to hate Fox a lot. Their response to SyFy taking it (or others; all of them knowing that the show was a sure win/win, but Fox being paranoid held onto it with a vice grip--why the hell did they do that? They gave away Futurama, so what was their beef with this little show?

At least, we got a movie. It explained most everything except Shepard Book and the "blue hands".

The writing on that show is still considered by me to be the best ever made/created. Writing on some shows are great, but the "change-up" in the vernacular was dead-on for every show. Which created another reason to watch. The writing style reminds me of Buffy+Leverage+George R.R. Martin novels (the character's responses and internal monologues)+ a little of Star Trek minus the campy tech talk or "Voyager solutions".

It's still sad to not have that around. I can only imagine what that series would be like now. All of the characters were likable and had individual flaws. Jane is a great example of this.

So again fuck you Fox (especially, the board responsible for the half-witted and half-ass job they did in managing it--yeah, I know they're gone know; hence the changes with Seth & Family Guy, Futurama, and allowing Joss Whedon to try another show...)

It's a TV serie, not a movie, and it's on HBO, which usually means quality.

As far as i know, the first season will be based on the first book only. That gives quite enough time to tell the story and introduce most of the cast without rushing things.

>> ^Stormsinger:

George R. R. Martin's books? Are they really making this story into a movie?
Much as I'd love to think otherwise, I don't see how it can be done...at least not without slashing the story to ribbons. There's just way too much content in any -one- of the books for a movie.

George R. R. Martin's books? Are they really making this story into a movie?

Much as I'd love to think otherwise, I don't see how it can be done...at least not without slashing the story to ribbons. There's just way too much content in any -one- of the books for a movie.

Yeah, the Dragonlance series is amazing. I have no patience for Lord of Rings, at least in book form, though.

In reply to this comment by Zifnab:
Well I'll give it a go. In no particular order:

1. Dragonlance Chronicles - Margaret Weis and Tracy Hickman. This is the series that really got me hooked on reading way back in high school and I still really enjoy it today.

2. Wheel of Time - RIP Robert Jordan. Brandon Sanderson is going to complete the final book (A Memory of Light) for RJ as the novel was incomplete at the time of his death.

3. Stranger in a Strange Land - Robert A. Heinlein. Along with most of Heinlein's other work.

4. Harry Potter - J. K. Rowling.

5. The Lord of the Rings - J.R.R. Tolkien.

Plus many more, as you can see I'm an avid reader of fantasy. I also really enjoy A Song of Ice and Fire by George R. R. Martin, The Sword of Truth by Terry Goodkind, The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy by Douglas Adams, The Chronicles of Amber by Roger Zelazny, and some other's that I can't think of at the moment...

Well I'll give it a go. In no particular order:

1. Dragonlance Chronicles - Margaret Weis and Tracy Hickman. This is the series that really got me hooked on reading way back in high school and I still really enjoy it today.

2. Wheel of Time - RIP Robert Jordan. Brandon Sanderson is going to complete the final book (A Memory of Light) for RJ as the novel was incomplete at the time of his death.

3. Stranger in a Strange Land - Robert A. Heinlein. Along with most of Heinlein's other work.

4. Harry Potter - J. K. Rowling.

5. The Lord of the Rings - J.R.R. Tolkien.

Plus many more, as you can see I'm an avid reader of fantasy. I also really enjoy A Song of Ice and Fire by George R. R. Martin, The Sword of Truth by Terry Goodkind, The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy by Douglas Adams, The Chronicles of Amber by Roger Zelazny, and some other's that I can't think of at the moment...

Kurt Vonnegut jr. is indeed the master. It's hard to pick just five, so this list might be a little random, but here are five books I have enjoyed immensely:

1. Cat's Cradle by Kurt Vonnegut jr.
2. 1984 by George Orwell
3. Catch 22 by Joseph Heller
4. Mengele Zoo by Gert Nygårdshaug
5. The Brothers Karamasov by Fjodor Dostojevskij

I especially like the religious themes in Cat's Cradle; that's why I picked it out to be on the list. But I have yet to read a Vonnegut book I didn't like, so many others could be there as well.

I really recommend Mengele Zoo to anyone who hasn't heard of it. It paints a horrible picture of the exploitation of South America, and has a main character you instantly fall in love with.

What the heck, I'll throw in a few more:
Everything by Tolkien, the A Song of Ice and Fire series by George R. R. Martin, The Eyes of the Dragon and the Dark Tower series by Stephen King, The Knights Templar series by Jan Guillou.