>> ^blankfist:
>> ^Lawdeedaw:
>> ^blankfist:
Statists seem to get away with murder.

And what, as I stated above, would be your response if this act was committed by astray protesters?
"Protesters seem to get away with murder."?

I'm not forced to pay for protestors.


Society does pay... At least in America. We would pay for them if they were uninsured (In higher prems charged by doctor's to recoup their losses) and of course the protesters' disabilties (Even if we did not have a disabilities program, they would still be a drain. Even if not crippled, and even if they had insurance (Which the insurance company would recoup from me and you) we would still pay in lost productivity...

So, to say you don't pay for them--you are right. But you pay if they are run over by madmen. Besides, that point aside, you said statists without knowing--and that is the real problem our country faces. People speaking without the information required to have a free society.

btw, where he's talking about texas's problem with the uninsured... texas's social services bureaucracy is an absolute joke and an abject failure. it's easier to just unite the majority against scary welfare mom's and indigent men than to fix it apparently.

>> ^blankfist:

Price increases started with government intervention that forced hospitals to treat everyone. Sure we want everyone to be taken care of, but if you come into the hospital with a hangnail or a runny nose, they MUST treat you.
And a lot of people don't pay their bill, and yet they're still allowed under penalty of law to return for service. Someone has to eat that cost, right? Well, welcome to the world of $7000 stitches.

I remember hearing a story from a guy I knew about the days before hospitals were required to treat you, a friend of his got in an auto accident but because he wasn't insured they just let him die. Seriously, I wonder how you can just stand by and watch someone die and still be called a doctor.

I imagine many people don't pay their bill, most uninsured people could never even afford a 7k medical bill anyhow, even if they wanted to pay. So they don't pay and the hospitals have to pass that on to the next guy who comes in, who can't pay either, pretty vicious cycle really.

>> ^bmacs27:

If he and the driver were uninsured, we just paid his medical expenses.


The driver is not liable for this idiot walking into his car.

If he and the driver were uninsured, we just paid his medical expenses.

Thanks for the quality, BMG!

In reply to this comment by bleedmegood:
also.....this is a *quality commercial.....i'll never drive uninsured again.

also.....this is a *quality commercial.....i'll never drive uninsured again.

JD,

People who are 400% above the poverty line will be subsidized for buying the insurance. So it's not like they have to pay premiums completely out of pocket.

To echo you: Did Obama do away with maximum policy coverage? YES HE DID. Co-pays go away for preventative care.

How does this prevent bankruptcies? Would you rather pay for a $500k surgery out of pocket, or pay $2-5k a month for insurance and let the policy handle the surgery costs? By shifting peoples obligation from the total cost of care to an insurance payment, that will help many avoid bankruptcy.

>> ^joedirt:

The only thing this does is say.. We will fix the uninsured problem. YOU MUST BUY HEALTH INSURANCE. poof problem solved.
It's like passing a law that says you will be fined if you are caught sleeping on the street. poof homeless is SOLVED!
This is just assholish to say, go buy insurance, then everyone will be insured. Also they are putting the burden on states to come up with how to handle people who cannot afford the $10,000. What will happen is outrageously expensive insurance plans, and also insurance that has gotchas and really covers nothing. They will just have a plan that only pays out like $5000 then it is all out of pocket. There is nothing to prevent them from doing this until like 2018.. and even then they will just take the fines.
Please explain to me how does this prevent someone from going bankrupt? Imagine you already have health insurance, even good coverage.. Plenty of people do and they are being screwed daily by insurers. It will be no different. Did Obama do away with co-pays and deductibles and maximum policy coverage? NO HE DIDN'T

The only thing this does is say.. We will fix the uninsured problem. YOU MUST BUY HEALTH INSURANCE. *poof* problem solved.

It's like passing a law that says you will be fined if you are caught sleeping on the street. *poof* homeless is SOLVED!

This is just assholish to say, go buy insurance, then everyone will be insured. Also they are putting the burden on states to come up with how to handle people who cannot afford the $10,000. What will happen is outrageously expensive insurance plans, and also insurance that has gotchas and really covers nothing. They will just have a plan that only pays out like $5000 then it is all out of pocket. There is nothing to prevent them from doing this until like 2018.. and even then they will just take the fines.

Please explain to me how does this prevent someone from going bankrupt? Imagine you already have health insurance, even good coverage.. Plenty of people do and they are being screwed daily by insurers. It will be no different. Did Obama do away with co-pays and deductibles and maximum policy coverage? NO HE DIDN'T

If I am not mistaken, this bill makes preventative care free.

At the end of the day in the U.S., I cannot see a doctor, unless I have a means to pay.

I recently moved, and found a new primary physician. On my first phone call to his office, before they would even talk about an appointment date and time, I spent 10 minutes on the line while the receptionist verified my insurance information and ability to pay. I know that this is a common occurrence.

This bill provides the means for more people to be able to pay. I also prevents, in the case of severe illness/injury, for people to go bankrupt. That's a huge step forward in my book, though not nearly enough. I wanted a public option, too, BTW.

>> ^rougy:

@<a rel="nofollow" href="http://videosift.com/member/longde" title="member since April 8th, 2009" class="profilelink">longde:
But insurers are only middlemen. They don't fix broken bones. They don't perform mammograms or change bedpans.
This didn't change anything about health care. It changed the routes and byways that are now mandated by the writ of law to make sure 30 million previously uninsured people are insured as long as the same private insurers that we all hated for so long remain the middlemen.
Real health care would have a provision for free yearly or biannual checkups for all adults. That would be an act of health care by providing a means of preventative medicine, which saves lives.
Real health care would have a provision about prenatal care.
Real health care would have a provision that reigned in pharma's ability to charge Americans $100 for drugs it sells in Mexico and Canada for $10.

@longde:

But insurers are only middlemen. They don't fix broken bones. They don't perform mammograms or change bedpans.

This didn't change anything about health care. It changed the routes and byways that are now mandated by the writ of law to make sure 30 million previously uninsured people are insured as long as the same private insurers that we all hated for so long remain the middlemen.

Real health care would have a provision for free yearly or biannual checkups for all adults. That would be an act of health care by providing a means of preventative medicine, which saves lives.

Real health care would have a provision about prenatal care.

Real health care would have a provision that reigned in pharma's ability to charge Americans $100 for drugs it sells in Mexico and Canada for $10.

It doesn't force anyone to buy health insurance unless you consider a $95/year tax on uninsured families 'forcing'. My family will get free(paid by taxes) medicaid for now since our total income is less than $29,000 and we will get really cheap insurance(2-9.5% of income) if we make more than that but less than $88,000. How are insurers going to survive with premiums capped at 1/10th or 1/20th of what they charge now? Does anyone here know if there will be regulations as to what the insurers have to cover and how high their deductibles can be?

taxocrats only care about expanding government. At MOST there are 12 million uninsured in America, not 50 million. A trillion "extra" dollars to cover 12 million uninsured seems like overkill, even for this government. And anyway there's not enough money for the entitlement programs already in place, so there's nothing left to pay for obamacare. Government never makes anything cheaper or more efficient, but hey, don't worry, Weiner's here to ensure "the American people aren't gouged." This guy and his ilk--all recipients of health care industry dollars just like the other side--will be dead and gone long before your great-grandchildren are paying for such follies, just like we today are still paying for FDR's and Johnson's.

honestly, on any given night in your typical emergency room... at least half the people you treat will not have health insurance, if anything this will lessen the burden on emergency rooms by allowing the uninsured access to primary care doctors.

although, i recently had to put my children on medicaid and now that they FINALLY have it, its fine. but TRYING to get on medicaid is fucking ridiculous. they lost my paperwork no less than 4 times. and i probably get something once a week that says something to the effect of MAIL THIS BACK IN 2 DAYS OR YOUR BENEFITS WILL BE CANCELED. i also have a friend that is a foster parent, she got a new foster child 2 months ago, this child was dropped off at her door in the middle of the night by a case worker from another county, since the child moved counties her medicaid was CANCELED. my friend is fostering a special needs infant with NO HEALTH INSURANCE. its been 2 months, medicaid still hasnt fixed this.

so...... medicaid is broken and i dont think i trust the government to do this correctly. at all.

"I know because I get paid to know" is remarkably weak reasoning.

I find that most debates with conspiracy theorist types devolve into a discussion of "How do you know anything?" with one side of the argument blindly believing mass media and the other side blindly believing anyone on AM radio. On health care, what's knowable is that uninsured people are suffering and dying to preventable ailments, and that life and pain-free living are not luxuries but human rights (whether or not the constitution explicitly says it).