@Trancecoach
i am going to have to disagree with your "free market" argument.(i snooped on your commentary on @eric3579 page).

and here is why:

since we both agree that what we have now is NOT a free market health care system and it is rife with corruption.we can move on to the real meat of the argument.

in my opinion the basic flaw in your argument is the base question.
free market or socialized medicine?

this is the wrong question.
because the questions ignores the very essence which we should be addressing.
the REAL question is "what is the purpose of a health care system"?
NOT "which market system should we implement for health care"?

so,
what IS the purpose of the health care system?

ah...
see where i am going with this?
not so easy to answer and impose your model of the "free market" at the same time.

because they are incompatible.
you cannot have "for-profit" and "health-care" work in conjunction with any REAL health care.

my family is in the medical field (as i know you are as well),and i have had this discussion with them many,many times.

when i have asked them "what is the best way to optimize a persons long term health"?
they have always answered,without exception "preventive care"."early diagnosis"."education on the benefits of diet and exercise".

and i suspect you would agree with their assessment.

but if we use your "free market" model against a more "socialized model".which model would better serve the public?

if we take your "free market" model,which would be under the auspices of capitalism.
where is the profit in a healthy society?
answer:there is none.
disease is where the money is at,THAT is where the profit lies,not in preventive medicine.

cancer,anxiety,obesity,drug addiction.
all are huge profit generators and all could be dealt with so much more productively and successfully with preventive care,diet and exercise and early diagnosis.

it is ineffecient and morally despicable and the costs are counted in dead bodies.

but when we consider that the 4th and 5th largest lobbyists are the health insurance industry and the pharmaceutical industry is it any wonder that america has the most fucked up,backwards health care system on the planet.

so if we used your "free market" model instead of the corporate welfare system we are using now.
the results would STILL be the same.
because BOTH systems are for-profit.

now,
let us examine medicare.
runs on a 3-5% overhead,while in contrast the health insurance industry runs between 25-35% and are..for-profit.

IF we made medicare available to ALL american citizens we would see a shift from latter stage care to a more aggressive preventive care and early diagnosis.
the savings in money (and lives) would be staggering.

this would create a huge paradigm shift here in america and we would see results almost instantly but more so in the coming decades.

i dont feel i have to list them because i respect your intellect.

i feel very strongly that health should be a communal effort.a civilized society should take care of each other.
a corporation cares nothing for my health nor yours.they care about profit.

and preventive care is NOT profitable,yet death and disease are.

so.
socialism>free market

Ooooohhh Sketchy, yer not supposed to admit that to anyone, remember?? (same goes true for those hailing from Rhode Island)-Never give away yer tells!

BTW @eric-So the Huffington post says she was drunk, as will any news agency when reporting on the "Evils of the Grain", but what they never tell you, is that the drunk nowadays, usually has a fat pharmaceutical addiction and is also floating on anti-depressants, otherwise known as mind-killers.

The bitch's problem is NOT anchored in alcohol alone...Oh and down-vote voyeurs poking-fun at human wreckage.

It is simple, lack of competition at the pharmaceutical, private hospital and insurance provider level with localized monopolies that jack up prices because of a lack of market pressure.

That is insane. I think it's an example of a solution looking for a problem. Some Pharmaceutical company probably discovered the formula and this was the only application they could find for it. But hey! They let you know risks! It's up to you now consumer!

the funniest/scariest part of these pharmaceutical ads is that it's almost impossible to tell if it is a parody or the real thing.

walk in to any drug store, which is an extension of western medicine...
and we have 4 main classes of drugs:
sugar
alcohol
tobacco
and prescription pharmaceuticals

the question is, which one kills you the fastest?

and what sort of profit incentive is there to keep you mired in your shitty health habits?

so @shveddy, who is reprimanding me for my "idiocy", would you please explain?

are you an md? if you are, the number of patients you see, the treatments you can provide, and what drugs you deal are dictated by insurance and pharmaceutical companies, and you have no choice but to comply while you pay off your 200k in loans.
Do you know what iatrogenic death means, or what the rate of iatrogenic death is? check it out....
There is plenty of quackery in the western md world.

as for Chiropractic, at least they are attempting to address the most glaring hole in western medicine: the rather obvious relationship between the structure of the body and the function of the body.

And when it comes to somatic/structural issues - which make up over 50% of hospital visits, and of which the western world treats with drugs or surgery, the chiro's at least have some of the theory correct, it's just their methodology that is fucked.

But, as for fundamental quackery, let's look at how the western world treats kids. First, hook them on sugar, then call them ADHD and give them methamphetamine salt (Adderol), followed by Ambien cause they can't sleep, followed by Prozac caused they are depressed cause they can't sleep, ...all the while they are raiding mom's medicine cabinet for the oxycontin or whatever opiate derivative they can find.
yeah, it's a JOKE. But we were trained to bow to authority, call the doctor god and worship the white coat and piece of paper on the wall.

I mean, for fuck's sake, listen to the side effect list of any major drug out there. really? that's "health care". bullshit.

Western md's shine in trauma, which was learned from our spirited attempts to have a continual state of warfare. for that they are top-notch. Anti-biotics were a huge deal, but all they've learned to do since the advent of penicillin is to make analogue after analogue, and they've stuffed so many people full of anti-biotics for just about every malady, that we are becoming genetically resistant to them as a species.
health care. yup.
how many of you out there can even afford this type of "health care"?
but please, do some research and go on for hours.

I was a bit brusque there, eh ant?? Ok, maybe I'm just a hater like those people addicted to pharmaceutical drugs and television have told me here.....

I guess it's time we stop using those incredibly stupid things called antibiotics because we're breeding resistant organisms for those as well. The facts make it damned clear that the only winner in this race are pharmaceutical companies. Patients pay more for the medicine as germs become more resistant. In another 20 years our antibiotics will be useless, but pharmaceutical companies will happily move on to the next longterm fuckup that is profitable in the short run.

While we're at it we should stop using idiotic chemotherapy and radiation for cancer because we only end up with resistant cells.

Do you really see no benefit to pesticides? Not a single upside? That's strange because they keep selling them. Someone's buying.

Hey detheter.." when an American tried to use an isolated case in Canada to justify opposition to gun regulations in the US"

Not true. Regulation of the insanity is all. See, here in America the current atmosphere of paranoia and mistrust of government was created not by and for any people but the ones running the entire planet into the shitter.
The worst city in the country(the one the President called home) from the worst state for crime (including police, whose collusion with criminals' in tomes) has the most restrictive gun laws. Television, the vilest of offenders offers-up pharmaceuticals, bobble-heads re-writing the English language and grooms fleshapoids for agendas whose brains are putty after years of programming.

Bottom-line for me nutters-all, would be this simple fact:
The police, military, active reserves, prison guards, private security forces, Nato troops, Swat teams, etc., all have weapons more capable of wreaking havoc on civilians than what civilians may already own or purchase therefore, Shouldn't civilians be so armed, under mandate of the natural order of life and freewill should they chose to do so, for what ever the reason as long as they are responsible for the same and ALSO responsible for taking part in the process that determines the equity of the laws governing their ownership and usage?

For the U.S., it will come eventually, as it will to the entire planet. Police, security, controlled, ordered, and sanctioned by mandate not vote.
Fascism plain and simple.
Radical Democracy, corporate police state, I don't care for either option thank you, and our shit would work just fine if the cunts were toppled and the script adjusted in favor of sanity over developmental disability and cushy slavery. Fuck That.

There already is a cure for idiocy and it has nothing to do with pharmaceuticals, I know you've been conditioned to think only drugs will cure everything, but it's not necessarily true!

The cure is simply using your brain, something a lot of gun obsessed yokels have never done.

Lyrics:
Im gonna smoke some weed, only got 20 dollas in my pocket
Imma huntin, looking for a pot shop, this is fucking awesome!

Walk into my house like what up, i got some good pot
I'm just pumped up got some herb from the pot shop
Ice in my fridge it used to be frosty
My friends like "Damn, that's a stoned ass donkey!"
Rollin' in hella high, looking like it's fifa time
Dominating all my friends, as I eat some chili fries
Draped in a snuggie with my girl sitting next to me
Probably shouldn't have had a big gulp full of ice tea
PISS!
But shit it was 99 cents!

I be blazin and smokin it
Bout to go and get some munchie snacks, passing up on those cracker jacks
Reeces Pieces are where it's at, Gotta get me some soda pop
Cotton mouth has been creeping up
But can't remember where I put my keys,
Yeah, that's what's up.
Imma take your grandpa's ride, Imma take your grandpa's ride
No for real, ask your grandpa, Can I take his 65?
Deville Cruisin to my local Publix
Nothing better than rolling with 2 super fly chicks!
They had frozen burritos, I bought frozen burritos
I bought some Ben and Jerry's, then I bought some Cheetos
Hello, Hello, my main man Obama
A couple states have just reformed their laws on marijuana
Whatcha gonna do, send the feds there? Hell no!
The DEA's would be like "Ah, they got Volcano"

What you know about the science of marijuana?
What you know about people suffering from glaucoma?
They need it, they need it, it helps them with their condition
If don't believe me, then just ask some eye physicians
Thank your granddad for voting for that guy Richard
Nixon is the President who made the plant illegal
But science is now showing that its medicine for people
And the private sector's fighting to keep all of that illegal
Alcohol and Tobacco, Pharmaceutical, Prisons
I'll take those four major lobby groups and fight those motherfuckers
They making money day and night, all those motherfuckers
And bribing congress out of sight, all those motherfuckers
They be like, "Oh, it's immoral and unhealthy"
I'm like how many people are you making wealthy
Anti-marijuana lobbies are making all kinds of profits
And they don't want you to stop it cause of all the special interests
I call that getting swindled and pimped, shit
I call that getting tricked by the government, that law's hella old
So its time to update it, regulate it, and then get it under state control
Peep Game, look into my political telescope
Think it's going to stay like this forever, nah, it hella won't, nah, it hella won't.

Let's end the war on drugs, It's time to pull the plug
These special interest groups are nothing more than corporate thugs
Let's end the war on weed, the people have agreed.
These special interest groups have kept these laws with bribery

Imma smoke some weed, only got 20 dollas in my pocket
Imma huntin, looking for a pot shop, this is fucking awesome!

Hmmm. Ok fucj it. I'll go and find a video with Aussies praising the confiscation of their property and rendering the place crime-free...ish.

This is more for the country that's headed towards a colossal fist-fuck because of politicians (criminals), pharmaceutical companies (insulated from mention by all major media and, not surprisingly, self-pimping turds without a clue like TYT, one of THE most flaccid, non-journalistic cretinfests on the web) who help to "create" mental-health problems larger than they need to be by unleashing damaged goods full of legal drugs prescribed by complicit doctors. Step in, the magic wand of unraveling and deconstruction of the U.S. Constitution by appointed and approved, so-called scholars from Harvard(oh hey, the same place not a few of the cunts who run the country hailed-from) to "provide" a solution for a problem that they created and you have the slow-motion train-wreck of the coming police state in one of the best places to be on the planet.

Everything is propaganda sparky, it's your job to wade through what you perceive to be bullshit, kinna like I'm wading thorough yours without really wanting to argue.

Brave New World. Newsflash: Eliminate gun-free zones, arm yourselves against an agenda to let mental health monstrosities roam the place un-checked on hardcore psychotropics with guns STOLEN from their fucked-up mommy, and don't ask a country who will hide their guns from a government determined to take them ALL away to accept anything less than a sane solution to what is primarily a problem created by the people with the MOST money, power, and influence.

Tell me why the pharmaceutical companies shouldn't be having their asses dragged across the coals on television for their part in mass-murder? Answer: Because they have more power and money than a gun lobby.

Again, I give fuck-all about loaded facts and figures form any side of the aisle, they mean dick because the real issue lies in governments fist-fucking their citizens. Shame on the the Brits for letting their government take their shit away and shame on the Aussies for letting the Crown fuck them as well.

great. except that it acts like the addiction "problem" is with illegal drugs. When in fact most people who have a dangerous addiction today are addicted to pharmaceuticals...or legals (alcohol, tobacco).
and it's not even close.

LSD can treat alcoholism ... MDMA for PTSD ... Ibogaine for opiates ... Hey, if someones idea of recreational use is taking psychotropic drugs, more power to them cause I dont want to. Their experiences are valuable data, and their stories are entertaining... better than talking to a drunk for sure


In November 2012, a Medical Marijuana facility in Israel announced a new strain of the plant which only has Cannabidiol as an active ingredient, and virtually no THC. This new strain gives the benefits of Medical Marijuana with none of the side-effects associated with being "high"

WHY isnt my country doing this research?? Blocking our research but funding a country that performs its own while not being able to share in the results... what in the hell is going on

Cannabidiol is unscheduled in the US. However tetrahydrocannabinols, both naturally and synthetically occurring, are currently classified under Schedule I of the US Controlled Substances Act ... SO IS THE PLANT ILLEGAL? OR JUST INGESTING IT? CAN WE GROW HEMP OR NOT????

Also the patent on cannabidiol that the US govt has through the dept of health and human services, granted in 2003 ... they are saving it for pharmaceutical companies, no laymen can grow a plant and use it... sickening...a crime that effects us all, user or not.

Hemp alone for pulp alone would be a huge boon to our economy, but nooooo, lets log wood for pulp??? Every level of cannabis prohibition smacks of ignorance and ulterior motives. Im tired of it. I live in WA state, and we proved it this year.