What's interesting is most subdural hematomas are venous bleeds (low pressure). This clearly had arterial bleeding, which is more consistent with epidural hematomas.

I call BS!
Let's see a man vs woman on this device...because otherwise it's apples vs oranges at best.
Some women have NO pain during labor (at least it's reported that some have the child and claim they didn't even know it happened), some have MAJOR pain. The only comparison would be if they do a real comparison of pain inducement (or multiple comparisons, one man or woman is not representative of all men or women). Then we might have a better grasp of who really handles it better....if one group does.
Also, note these men did this to themselves with no 'payoff', while many women opt out of the experience with an epidural. It's a different thing when you are consciously subjecting yourself to pain than when it's simply happening with no escape. That's not taken into account at all in this 'experiment'.
I want to see it tried again my way, this answered nothing! (It was still hilarious)

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But where does that stop? Should insurance be able to deny pregnancy aid if it is not high risk? (You could argue fuck yes! Pregnancy is a woman's choice. You want to get pregnant, you get help from the pharmacy down the street! Sonograms? Fuck you.)

What about things to reduce pain like epidural? If they denied that maybe women would stop having babies so don't you think that wise?

Comment hidden because you are ignoring dag. (show it anyway)

^I wasn't saying that it was all about money - though I do think that's a part of it for many. I think that the medical profession appeals to individuals who enjoy having power over other people. I feel the same way about police.

I don't think it's right to paint all doctors as great martyrs- doing it all for their community. They are human, and there is a whole spectrum of motivations. I certainly don't think they deserve quite the pedestal that most people place them on - or a free-ride, or even the benefit of the doubt.

I'm generalizing and speaking from personal experience only for sure. These are my opinions, but I don't think it's fair to call them ignorant. There's a level of hubris, and blind certitude that goes along with medicine - that is, in my opinion unscientific.

Things like the over-prescription of anti-biotics, the over-use of epidurals, scheduled caesarians to match convenient days, the debacle of dangerous drugs like Viox, Fen-phen and others -- deserve scrutiny and assessment - not a white washing over, and dismissal that doctors play no role in these matters.

These guys are still around, they're just pushing other drugs besides nicotine:

>> ^dag:
I do think they cultivate such an environment, perhaps not intentionally in all cases - but the relationship between patients and doctors, in my experience is mostly about domination and control. I'm not against medical science, I am for breaking down the walls between the medical world and consumers.

That is starting to change. The old generation of doctors, especially surgeons do have a paternalistic relationship with their patients. However, for quite a while now, medical education has shifted heavily to a patient centered, team based approach.

And as E_Nygma pointed out, it is great that your births went well. But having worked in Obstetrics and seen some of the fucking complication nightmares that can occur, it is ridiculous for me to even consider a birth without some form of OR and surgical team ready on hand. And there is such a huge shortage of OBs that it's hard to find one who is not overworked and overstressed. They do it out of a sense of duty to their communities and their profession. They sacrifice their personal lives so that in case the shit hits the fan, there's someone there to save you. And it's not that some OB's prefer C-Sections just for their patients for profit. Studies show that a significant portion of OBs prefer, and select C-sections for themselves. It's not some industry trying to screw you out of your money.

And painting epidurals as something unnecessary, and used instead to line the OB's pockets, is so ignorant. You might as well say the same thing of antibiotics, vaccines, and anesthetics in general.

Comment hidden because you are ignoring dag. (show it anyway)

I do think they cultivate such an environment, perhaps not intentionally in all cases - but the relationship between patients and doctors, in my experience is mostly about domination and control. I'm not against medical science, I am for breaking down the walls between the medical world and consumers.

>> ^E_Nygma:
while i'd agree with you that women in labor are sometimes intimidated by hospital settings and made uncomfortable within them, to say that the medical industry and its practitioners intentionally cultivate such an environment is a slap in the face of a multitude of people who have dedicated a majority of their lives to helping others. it's also plain wrong. i've never seen an epidural given to a woman who didn't want one, but i've seen plenty of women begging for pain relief who initially wanted none. while i'm glad your personal experience of home birth went well, like tymbrwulf points out, there are many for whom unique circumstances result in an emergency trip to a hospital and a birth that is far from optimal.
>> ^dag:
The patrician medical industry is vested in keeping childbirth a scary, painful experience. Epidurals and C-sections are their favorite tools.

In a "proper" medical society, the money the hospital makes on surgery etc. does not factor in to anything. When procedures and medicine are compromised my money concerns from doctors, everyone suffers.

Hospitals are intimidating to anyone at almost all times, so it's no wonder that people can be pushovers in a situation like child birth, where both parents are pretty vulnerable. The problem with this is that doctors and nurses incentives are not necessarily to give the parents the best care, but doing it the easiest way possible for the hospital.

My own (I use the word lightly) recent experience with friends that had a baby is much different - they were given pretty free reign over what they could do, how it should be and such. They were given a bunch of counseling on it and made the decision based on that and their own research. The hospital wanted to give her an epidural, but she refused and pulled through (so to speak).

I think there are inherent dangers in disliking the medical system, because there is so much "alternative" stuff out there that is complete bullshit. Not wanting to pop pills for everything is one thing, but a doctor does have a lot of training (and hopefully experience) - going "back to basics" and birthing in a freaking stable is not a better way, but it can be an alternative if the doctors OKs it (from the pre-birth tests and such). It can certainly limit the amount of intimidation that can arise from being in a hospital, but if something _bad_ happens, I would feel much safer in the hospital personally.

while i'd agree with you that women in labor are sometimes intimidated by hospital settings and made uncomfortable within them, to say that the medical industry and its practitioners intentionally cultivate such an environment is a slap in the face of a multitude of people who have dedicated a majority of their lives to helping others. it's also plain wrong. i've never seen an epidural given to a woman who didn't want one, but i've seen plenty of women begging for pain relief who initially wanted none. while i'm glad your personal experience of home birth went well, like tymbrwulf points out, there are many for whom unique circumstances result in an emergency trip to a hospital and a birth that is far from optimal.

>> ^dag:
The patrician medical industry is vested in keeping childbirth a scary, painful experience. Epidurals and C-sections are their favorite tools.

>> ^dag:
The patrician medical industry is vested in keeping childbirth a scary, painful experience. Epidurals and C-sections are their favorite tools.


I hope you're joking. That's about as ignorant as Bill Maher's view on vaccines.

Comment hidden because you are ignoring dag. (show it anyway)

The patrician medical industry is vested in keeping childbirth a scary, painful experience. Epidurals and C-sections are their favorite tools.

It's amazing how many hospitals refuse to even try a vaginal birth after c-section.

And it's amazing how many c-sections are performed just to prevent litigation! They wanted to stop me from birthing vaginally three times and c-section me, but I refused, vociferously. They even tried to prevent me from moving to a different position. They want you on your back with your legs in the air. It's so backwards and against nature. My son was presenting face up in the preliminary stages, but he was born face down and normal. No c-section needed. But boy did they try to frighten me into agreeing to it. They had a parade of doctors and nurses trying to scare the crap out of me so I did what they wanted, so it would be easier for them, so I would have my baby "before the nurses changed their shift." WTF?

As a woman, giving birth, you are perhaps more vulnerable and scared than you've ever been in your life and they really try to take advantage of that and press you into doing things that you don't need. Like c-sections, epidurals, breaking your water prematurely, pitocin to induce contractions, not eating for 48 hours, etc etc etc. It's ridiculous. They only do these things to prevent lawsuits.

And look what happens when you do exactly what they want. Oh no, the scarring from your c-section could cause your uterus to rupture if you got pregnant again! Gah.. It really gets my fucking goat. I feel for this woman. I feel for all women who are subjected to having a natural process turned into a medical "emergency".

Wow, I said more than I had intended. TL;DR, eh?

what a beautiful lady you are!

my brother spent 8 years as an army intelligence officer. one of his friends got deployed while his wife stayed back home pregnant. she was astranged from her own family, so my brother took on the role of her birth coach and support while her husband was away. she went into the labor a few weeks early. she called my brother, he rushed from work at the base to go and pick her up and head to the hospital they thought they had at least a few hours ahead of them. on the way they got stuck in traffic. jam. stuck. san antonio traffic is a beast. he pulled over, called the ambulance and hopped in the backseat with her. when the ambulance finally arrived the babies head was out. the paramedics took over just in time and my brother who has no children of his own and is terrified of anything medical, literally goes into shock whenever he gets an iv, quietly hyperventilated while they got mommy and baby stablized and into the ambulance. they rode off the hospital mommy and baby were fine and well and my brother accidentally helped deliver a beautiful healthy baby boy in the back of his convertible. yayayayay!!!!

and yeah, id say there is an information vacuum when it comes to what your birthing options are.
both of my children were born at the hospital i worked out and we had excellent care and a fabulous doctor. but i think if i ever do it again id like to have a midwife and a doula with more natural pain control options, especially since neither of my epidurals took and i had a really really bad pain control experience with my first child.

I wouldn't want to be in the position of having to stick a needle into someone's spinal cord for all of the rice in China.

My parents are anesthesiologists though, and apparently it isn't that big a deal. You do it by feel. One crunch and you're in the subarachnoid space (or whatever), two and you're in the epidural space.

Very interesting video. I always like these surgery videos, but it kind of takes the magic out of it. When it comes down to it, they're just cutting and sewing and chopping and scraping and shoving. Knee replacements are the worst. Then they're doing a good deal of hammering too.