20 years ago was the tail end of the shareware boom, which is a different approach to "freemium". In that model, developers created a great game (Wolfenstein, Doom, Duke Nukem, Jazz Jackrabbit, Quake, OMF 2097, etc) and gave you a sizable, fully playable chunk of it for free as promotion.

The difference is, back then there was not much attention paid to "casual gaming". Games were designed to be fun and challenging. Times have changed and now games are designed to be easy and addictive instead.

Today's freemium model is more like video poker. It's not much fun but you keep putting money in because of the potential for an easy reward. That's the mechanic that keeps gambling addicts going back to the casinos and it's also the business model that makes "casual gaming" so profitable without having to make good games.

Comment hidden because you are ignoring dag. (show it anyway)

Definitely not going to be competition for the Xbox 720 - but some people are more interested in casual gaming (Angry birds) or retro gaming (MAME) and this will be perfect for that.

Also I think people are a tired of all the novel controls - Kinnect, numchucks, wands, boards, guitars. Some people just want to play games with their thumbs.

To call the battlefield franchise "well made" is a bit of an insult to high quality fps games. BF2 was released CHOCK full of bugs (if you played it, you'll know) and was left unmaintained. Certain game-breaking bugs were left in for months and months at a time despite ruining huge aspects of the game. On top of the bugs that were not fixed, new content was released and promoted - that ALSO contained bugs. Even when bugs were fixed, new bugs were introduced. And many of the fixes involved changes that negatively affected other aspects of play! How can this be called "well made"?

I consider myself an experienced gamer. I enjoy many genres, and have been playing for ~18 years. I don't just play huge titles, but i do play those too. I play indie games, casual games, you name it. The only company that i go out of my way to avoid is EA and that's due to bad experiences with their games. I am not "just a hater", as i did play dragon age and sang its praises once i'd come to accept that it wasn't simply another standard EA title.

Take bioware for example. Before they were 'bought' by EA they made some of the (arguably, but almost universally accepted) best games of their particular genre. Baldur's gate 1 and 2, neverwinter nights.... we're talking sweeping epics that involved in depth and original story lines that carried the game single handedly (i mean, it was only isometric, the story was everything). Then suddenly, EA get involved and bioware produce mass effect - instead of being able to choose from a plethora of moral and immoral dialog options, actions, we get a good/neutral/evil meter and equivalent options. I'm not going to tell anyone mass effect is a bad game; it is up to the public to decide and they have decided it's good. But i insist that, but for the dated graphics, their earlier RPGs were better in every single other way, and what they provide in their modern RPGs falls short on any RPG checklist you care to make when you put it up against Baldur's gate, icewind dale, etc.

I was very excited when dragon age was released, but then immediately disappointed again when dragon age 2 was released - and who can honestly claim that 2 lived up to 1? Can anyone deny that it was shat out at maximum velocity to cash in quickly on the success of the first? It was a completely different game!?

I hope i have managed to not sound like an anti-fanboy cock; i have spent hundreds and hundreds of pounds on game flops by EA which were underhandedly promoted by reviewers that i then learned not to trust. I feel utterly cheated by them but that is why i don't buy their games now, and that's why you'll find more and more people expressing the opinions herein and in the video. So yes, it's very easy to say "lolz u shudnt buy there gamez u foolz", but when there's several teams of people working together to try and trick you into doing something it may take you a few goes before you learn what the shape of the turd looks like. It's underhanded and i would have thought you could understand why people get annoyed by that.

I'm not surprised piracy has increased with the steady decline in VALUE FOR MONEY. I payed £30 for half life 1 and i still play it to this day. I'd gladly pay £100 for it in retrospect. The first installment of a battlefield game costs me £40, and £15 for an extra few maps or guns they add. Valve are still giving me stuff for free, and i cannot thank them enough for putting pride in their work, and for that they will have the kind of brand respect that EA will never get.

@Fletch hit the nail right on the head. I don't think people who disagree are stupid, or wrong, or anything. But if you haven't experienced the old AND the new (that goes for everyone, not just fans of the new or just fans of the old), then you are not in an ideal position to put forward arguments about whether or not games have increased in value for money, or decreased in value for money; i'm glad you enjoy modern games, but i feel disappointed and cheated by them and that's a perfectly valid thing to express, and it is not your place to tell someone they're over reacting or being a baby. If you haven't tried it yourself, you can't know for sure.

I think that is what this guy was trying to say in a humourous way, probably didn't do the best job of it ever but it was at least funny. And do remember it was meant to be funny. I think some people in this thread in favour of EA have looked more foolish in their pro-EA arguments than this guy did in his anti-EA exaggerations. Remember it was meant to be funny.

TL:DR - i don't blame you

Like @gorillaman said, the social aspect of the site isn't the most important thing. If someone doesn't want to interact with others it's easy to turn off all notifications and just ignore "props".

I personally like the quest feature as it gets me to try out different things and set goals I wouldn't have otherwise. It has an interesting casual game like feel similar to videosift, only without all the dicks.

This is what I mean, side to side movement can be countered by overcorrecting the tilt. This would explain why the table's apparent movement is so large. >> ^messenger:

If it were above the ship's roll centre, then it would have a lot of side-to-side movement to compensate for which is hard when your range of motion is mostly up and down. It would be easier towards the outside of the ship where there's a lot less side-to-side movement, and more up-and-down, which would merely increase or lessen the gravity on the balls, which is no big deal in a casual game.>> ^Spacedog79:
A mechanical gyro causing the movement would have delay and the balls would roll slightly. Assuming the table is above the ship's roll centre, the table would have to over correct for the ship's movement in order to keep the balls exactly in place. Most likely electronic gyros and good hydraulics with no stiction and powerful enough to not be affected by players putting pressure on the table.

If it were above the ship's roll centre, then it would have a lot of side-to-side movement to compensate for which is hard when your range of motion is mostly up and down. It would be easier towards the outside of the ship where there's a lot less side-to-side movement, and more up-and-down, which would merely increase or lessen the gravity on the balls, which is no big deal in a casual game.>> ^Spacedog79:

A mechanical gyro causing the movement would have delay and the balls would roll slightly. Assuming the table is above the ship's roll centre, the table would have to over correct for the ship's movement in order to keep the balls exactly in place. Most likely electronic gyros and good hydraulics with no stiction and powerful enough to not be affected by players putting pressure on the table.

Comment hidden because you are ignoring dag. (show it anyway)

My problem is that at my point in life I only have the time for casual games. (Peggle anyone? I know I'm lame) but I love the immersive rich world of a game like Skyrim. Someone needs to make a casual Skyrim. In and out in an hour would be great. >> ^dag:

I have to admit - this does look pretty fun.

>> ^RFlagg:

Even if this is the next expansion, and that is possible since they did register the trademark for it (but with Diablo 3 coming out, not sure they would risk splitting the player base and hold off on an actual expansion for a while later, then again Cataclysm isn't doing as well as they hoped and they said they want faster times between expansions... and I would guess there will be some Titan info coming out at this years BlizzCon which would also take away the expansions thunder), this doesn't mean the Pandarens will be a playable race. I doubt they would let them be a playable race unless they have a mechanic to let it be neutral. He kept calling it class rather than race, but as to their classes, I would guess there would be some sort of martial art type class that would be unique to them, and I would guess they would kick ass if they were playable. If it is a WoW expansion, and I doubt it, then I doubt they are playable and likely just the area that opens up, and neutral to both sides, but plenty of beer available, and perhaps a brewers secondary profession.
My guess is that the Mists of Pandaria is likely a mobile app or Facebook/Google + type app rather than a proper WoW expansion. Either way I am sure BlizzCon will answer that.
My BlizzCon predictions are that it will largely be about Diablo 3, with Titan getting some initial details to expand on the earnings report that said it will be a casual game... I take casual to be like Farmvile, others say WoW itself is casual so who knows what they meant by Titan being casual. Mists of Pandaria will be a third also ran story if it is indeed just a mobile or social gaming app.


RFlagg gains Inability to form Paragraphs buff
Block of Words crits Yogi for 2,000,000
Yogi's Witty Response is Resisted
Yogi Dies

Even if this is the next expansion, and that is possible since they did register the trademark for it (but with Diablo 3 coming out, not sure they would risk splitting the player base and hold off on an actual expansion for a while later, then again Cataclysm isn't doing as well as they hoped and they said they want faster times between expansions... and I would guess there will be some Titan info coming out at this years BlizzCon which would also take away the expansions thunder), this doesn't mean the Pandarens will be a playable race. I doubt they would let them be a playable race unless they have a mechanic to let it be neutral. He kept calling it class rather than race, but as to their classes, I would guess there would be some sort of martial art type class that would be unique to them, and I would guess they would kick ass if they were playable. If it is a WoW expansion, and I doubt it, then I doubt they are playable and likely just the area that opens up, and neutral to both sides, but plenty of beer available, and perhaps a brewers secondary profession.
My guess is that the Mists of Pandaria is likely a mobile app or Facebook/Google + type app rather than a proper WoW expansion. Either way I am sure BlizzCon will answer that.
My BlizzCon predictions are that it will largely be about Diablo 3, with Titan getting some initial details to expand on the earnings report that said it will be a casual game... I take casual to be like Farmvile, others say WoW itself is casual so who knows what they meant by Titan being casual. Mists of Pandaria will be a third also ran story if it is indeed just a mobile or social gaming app.

I think one of his arguments is that Iphone Games Are less derivative of eachother and not simple cash ins ( to the extent of AAA games), (although that's not his central points and i'm just elaborating on this one thing for the sake of brining it to light)

This is simply not true , granted you don't see 10x of the same game typ on the app store front end , but that's because they are often copping from flash games which act as a filter , app store is just a part of the "micro casual game" market place which would incude , flash , andriod ,xbl indi, and other such services. ( the popularity aspect of how the app store lists games is also a filter but just because you cannot see them on the front end dose not mean that the vast majorty of content avalable is not dervtive and a cash in , in the same way console games are.

angry birds for example is esentualy another developer cashing in on a game like crush the castle .

I don't mind people cashing in on game ideas or concepts , but what I do dislike is that the guys that made crush the castle would now find it very hard to make decent money from that game on iphone. ( I believe both authors should receive fair compencastion , crush castle devs for original concept , and angry bird devs for building on it.

Its allot harder to make Serous money from a flash game hit than it is to make decent money from a I phone hit , angry birds has probably made the devs over £1Mil where as crush the castle on flash maby 20-50k

>> ^coolhund:

That was such an awesome game. But thanks to consoles the time of such PC games is over.
Really sad to see games actually regress to a point where very old games like this has the superior gameplay.


I think actually what you will find is that the most inovatve games can still be found on pc.

the thing you see less now on pc are giant publisher cash cows , which more often than not contain the same old game play repackaged. something that i am not sad to see leave pc.

pc innovated in FPS in the late 90s and early 00s, pc games are now innovating in other places such as social gaming ultra casual gaming. I think pcs will always be home to developers like Frictional Games or independents that don't want to dip into funding.

I think consoles are gr8 fun , but the thing that pcs or open architecture platforms will allays have is this Testbed mentality where new concepts can be knocked out , before risk adverse publishers will back them and push them on platforms like ps3 360. granted u have psn and xbl arcade and indi but i dont realy think they are that viable for an indi as primary ditrabutoin platform where as pc and some of the new mobile platforms are.


any way , lol my point is I think pc will be the place where games as gr8 and revolutionary as home world will be spawned ( the majority of the time). and console will pretty much be the place where well tried and tested games will be found. at least in the western markets ,

in Japan they are far more open about having new and often totally mental ideas debue on console. I guess relative to the madness found in manga and animé its a safe bet for them , I also think cultraly they can easily separate core game play mechanics from the visual context.


What is disastrous however is that on pc we are now getting shit console ports constantly so i guess that aspect of pc gaming is pretty shitty.

Dedicated servers are not important for console games , the whole point of a console ( for me any way) is its a simplified gaming exsperance for the sake of convenience.

The Most Important thing for a console game is that you can shove it in the disk try and be playing on-line with friends within 3 minutes and have a good gaming session and for that I will sacrifice depth and graphics , audio quality . ( I also quite like playing well structured games on console with specifc challenges split second was pritty much the perfect console driving game for me interms of how single player was layed out)

having non dedicated servers and using x box match making properly allows this , a complete moron idoit player can pritty mich be garentied to be playing with friends online in under 4 min. and thats one of the reasoins I ike my 360 ill pop it on and have quick bash at a game and u can get quite allot of enjoyment from it

THE issue happens for pc games I will list why its an issue on pc

1) Lag people using pcs often have drastically different ping's especaily if u playing with noobs this can affect game play badly
2) no custom maps and mods / servers that are well managed by admin ( which is very important for pc games)
3) cheeting , IT is allot esear to cheet and far harder if not impossable to boot people that are cheeting

Fundimentaly pcs are a different platform Each game that comes out on a pc is more like a Club and has an associated community around it , and each server has its own community and club like environment. granted all of them are selling the same beer but you will go to specific servers for the spectifc abeance.

This is the thing , a good pc game will last for 8 + years , console games like MW2 are designed around players getting 60-100 hours of game play out of it and then throwing it away.

The biggest issue with pc games is that it can be a total dick getting a game together with friends and you have to be a comparative expert to get a game going with people although steam has made this less of an issue with many games.

ether way due to the nature of pc games and the complexity involved you normally end up with a deeper game play exsperance something more sophisticated , Consoles are like the MacDonalds and pc is like a privetely owned restrant.

having said that you do get games on pc that take the best from console and pc ( track mania for example ) and you also get games on console that can offer a good degree of sophistication.


MY BIGGEST GRIPE WITH CONSOLE GAMES at the moment is the cheek of publishers charging for DLC when the game has such limited content in the first place , a perfect example is with HALO 3 i picke dup a coppy recently as i never owned it myself just played with friends , and u need DLC ( or halo ODST which came out allot latter) in order to play 1/2 of the multilayer exsperance.

I dont mind paying for DLC if it was a fair price , for example a new map for MW2 should cost 35-50p If you bare in mind you pay £3.50 a month for XBox live gold , and they make a substatail profit from that.

Its starting to move to pc , thank fully APB has been a total flop and the developer has fucked themselves by charging a totally absurd price for there game and in game content,


IN SHORT LOL

dedicated servers is pretty much inconsequential for console games
But not having them is terrible for pc games (unless its a very casual game or a specific game that do-sent require dedocated servers 4 player max typ games coop ect. )

>> ^spoco2:

Wow, way to create a trailer for a system that completely DOESN'T differentiate it from the Wii... good work Sony... sigh


what they have done is make a system thats actualy responsaive , the wii motes are shockingly inacuret.
and manny people hate the graphical styl of the vast majorty of wii games.

In the end all bissinesses take ideas from eachother i dobt nintendo came up witht he wii mote in the first place they just decided to go behind it with a console.

if annything microsoft is more gulty of coppying the wii whats funny is kinect looks realy laggy and pritty much entrly suted to casual games where acurecy is not so important ( ala wii games) where as sony have a platform that can work well with casual and core games.

in the end , nintendo need to beef up there console evan if its only as fast as a 360 or slighty slower it just needs to do HD and allow support for non cartony games, nintendo allso needs to sort out multiplayer they should just clone what MS have done ,

MS need to make more party games that work over there multiplayer system, and sony need to lower the price of everything and improve there networking service.

Thanks. My problem is free time (0-2 hours a week). I barely play anything these days and still have many old games to play like Oblivion, Crysis, World in Crysis, C&C3:KW, etc.


In reply to this comment by Drax:
No the game is very very bug free now. However, it is a huge time eater though, it can take hours and hours to complete a user made mission. MP Games can be more pop-in, pop-out but it takes longer to do certain things, which is what I love. You feel more like you're in a real war, that's happening in a real environment. Plus you really do want to get some mods going with this game. (kinda like Oblivion, but not nearly as many mods to choose from as that one). It's not a casual game by any stretch.

Oh and also, if you don't have a quad core (or better) performance wont be too hot. The game renders huge areas, with lots of AI activity at times. Frame rates can drop considerably in gun fights if you're just running a dual core (like me). I'm holding off on playing much more of the game till my new rig is built.. gonna be a few months.

In reply to this comment by ant:
I tried the demo, but it was SO buggy and hard to play. Is it still like that?

>> ^SpeveO:
If you look at the compositing breakdown here you'll see that all the tree stuff has been done in 3d. I'm guessing that he used Speedtree.


So he did lol , amazing what you can do with good textures and a bit of animation. I guess for that shot with the camere panning back as it did makes sence to use CG trees , personally i would have used footage and comped it to save on time.

Have you used speed tree?

all my modeling within 3ds max has been for games so I haven't relay had a chance to fiddle with really lush pluggins. I think sometime in the future I might Go back and try and do something nice get up to date with the new Z brush , all my work now is in 2d and music.

Its quite amusing actually i know a cupple of people that leanrt 3ds max and high end 3d stuff and now they are all working in 2d in the casual game arena.


Also interestingly One of the things this video really demonstrates is good use of Depth of field Its all done in post but its probably contributes to the rilisum and gives the mostly static scenes alot of life and contemporary feel I think students should just watch this video it demonstrates so Manny things really well allot of them reasonably simple to implement but they r things that make your project like infinitely better.