Persephone,

As a decent looking straight guy, I sometimes get attention from people I don't find particularly attractive, or other guys. When this happens, my evolutionary instincts tell me to shun these people, but rather than give into my cold and pragmatic animal innards, I instead smile and treat the unwanted admirer with respect.

Admiration is a compliment, no matter who it comes from and it can feel pretty shitty when you are on the other side of this equation.

Yes, there is an attractiveness caste system, and yes, it serves an important evolutionary function, but isn't it our job as human beings to try to rise above some of the superfluous side-effects of our violent, prejudiced and cruel animal nature?

When someone from a higher attractiveness caste gives me a knowing glance or a wink, I don't interpret it as an invitation to sex, but rather as another human being, confident enough in their own moccasins to show some humanity.

I think it is a testament to the power of beauty that we feel empathy (yes, I feel it too) for people who are basically saying "OMG, ugly people are looking at me.... Make them stop!"

Dag,

If skinless corpses start turning up, we'll know where to send the cops.

Mix,

It sounds like your daughter could teach those in this video a thing or too. What instrument does she play?

MG,

Well said, I agree.

ScottishMartialArts,

Good point on the stereotypes. Speaking personally(Liberal/White/Male/American/Californian/Musician/Drummer), the only negative stereo-types that bug me are the ones that are true.

kronos,

You mention pretty women struggling with the glass ceiling, but again, as MG says, I think hitting the ceiling is the kind of problem you WANT to have. How many smarter/better qualified employees did these pretty women step over on their way up the ladder to the glass ceiling?

Good discussion all. I love dissecting these types of societal taboos.

Hindu has its extremists as well, but whatever.

Yeah, that Gandhi - where the hell did he get off NOT using violence? It's un-American!

Congrats on the dumbest defense of religion I've ever heard.
DING! DING! DING!
You just won a free lesson in Hindu caste systems.

Just claim your price <ahref="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dalit">Here.

Oh and that was not me defending the actions of the protesters. While I may agree with them on some points, I do think it is best to respect the beliefs of others. I simply thought it ironic that people are more interested in posting the intolerance of some, mostly Christians and Muslims, yet totally ignore some of the horrendus acts of intolerance elsewhere, like <ahref="http://www.savetibet.org/news/positionpapers/religiouspersecution.php">this, <ahref="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Christians#Persecution_of_Christians_in_China">this, and <ahref="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bJM3BoBNrdk">this.

I see a trend. People see what they want to see. Some just want another reason to bash religion.

I think the Founders realized the potential problem of the mob rule, which is why they setup this "caste system" that you are referring to. We don't live in a democracy, but a republic, where common people can influence politicians and courts, but can't make laws directly. In order to be in the position of power, you have to be well educated, which essentially shuts the ignorant masses out of politics. The Founders didn't even trust the common people to elect the president themselves, hence the electoral college system.

So my point is that this "master/slave" arrangement has been put in place by the Founders of the United States, and it's worked well so far, better than the places that tried more egalitarian arrangements.

As far as interest rate on National Debt goes, the figures are misleading. Most of US debt is internal. This means that United States owes money to itself, so it's not debt in the traditional sense. There's disagreement over how much foreign debt there is, because there's no reliable way of measuring it. According to one measure, US is actually a net creditor, in other words, the world owes more money to US than the other way round -- http://www.ksg.harvard.edu/ksgnews/Features/opeds/120805_hausmann.htm

Thanks for the explanation of the caste system, mate.

From the date this country was founded, I'm sure you can find laws that were created that courts were obligated to abide by. If "order and justice" is so difficult to maintain that ANY given caste of people must remain outside of it, this country has been incredibly deceived for quite a long time.

I happen to believe it's time that ends. I do not believe that you or I are any more intelligent than "common people" due to the way we interpret the legal system...as a matter of fact, I find that there are many areas of study that I could simply not comprehend, but others are expert in, because of the differences in our lives. I believe we are "common people," and I have yet to meet any person that could claim they are not(yes, even the incredibly rich and/or educated).

Essentially, you're saying that facts are arbitrary to opinion, and while that's true in a philosophical sense, in the physical sense(which is the universe we live in), when I give a person one apple, even though they have the potential to grow a whole tree from it, they currently only have one physical apple. Their opinion of what they currently have does not change the fact that they are only holding one physical apple, and not an entire tree, at the moment.


To put it simply, my friend - to have a view of the human race as essentially master/slave the way you state above, that "common people tend to be uneducated, and shouldn't be trusted with such legal matters," I can only speculate that you do not take consideration into the technicalities of things you consider to be "common knowledge."

The Constitution was written with the intention that the common person could interpret it, and that the interpretation of it, by ANYBODY, would not be construed as to deny or disparage rights retained by the people. I understand that they screwed up on many things, like not giving women or blacks the right to vote, etc., but they did understand that it would be revised(and even created the Amendment process, to give it the ability to be revised). I believe their intention was that any revisions would not deny American citizens their rights, however, as is stated in the Bill of Rights.

Now, of course, you are addressing how the law is practiced right now, and I am addressing how the law should be practiced, but is that not what this documentary, and many others that we debate on the forums of, is about? - that somewhere along the line of American History, the system that was created to work in our interests started working against us, that we must now subscribe to systems that we neither believe to to benefit us, nor do we desire.

Like the Federal Income Tax. Surely you understand that almost every cent we pay toward the Federal Income Tax goes toward interest accrued on the national debt? How, then, does it benefit you to pay Federal Income Tax, when you neither receive service for it, nor is the government required(nor do they have a plan) to lower the national debt so we could use our Federal Income Tax dollars for something that would benefit us(unless, of course, you receive dividends from the Federal Reserve )?

I do understand, in incredible detail, how the system currently operates. How do you think it should operate, and more importantly - why do you think it should operate that way?

"Hindus and Buddhists aren't strapping on bombs."

If you knew anything about the race riots in India you would now about the appalling crimes committed by Hindu extremists against Muslims - I suggest you read Arundhati Roy's 'The Algebra of Infinite Justice' where you can read about Hindu gangs blowing up mosques and Muslim homes, burning Muslims alive and pregnant Muslim women having their stomachs slashed open and their unborn babies ripped out and thrown into fires.

>>>> It's true that Muslims don't hold the patent on barbarity. You can site Hindu extremism, but the flavor is a little different; they have their own caste system that pits one against the other in addition to anti-other-religions nuts. But despite their problems, India's loudest leading religious leaders aren't at war with the West and no American that recognizes Hindus fears them. Indian people have integrated well in American society.

"You are in the unenviable position of defending the indefensible."

Right back at you - I preach tolerance and understanding, you preach intolerance and hate. I have studied Islam and lived in the Islamic world - you've probably never been to university and don't even have a passport. You are not a monster - you're just plain ignorant.

>>>> I preach intolerance and hatred of the same fanatical side of Islam that you purport to abhor. I take it you're not an American (I am unsure of this) so the fury at watching American innocents die on 9-11 means something different to me than it does you.

>>>> On a personal level, I view the trappings of the Muslim faith as overly complicated and needlessly dogmatic.

>>>> Where we differ is, I see the rest of Islam as backwards. Not evil per se, but unfit and unworkable in its present state the 21st century. Muslims move into Western countries and refuse to assmilate. That's not immigration, that's invasion, and the politically-correct cowards who tolerate this will soon find themselves without a country, as is happening all over Europe.

>>> I invite you to read this essay by one Robert Locke, from 2002. I think you will find yourself agreeing with much of it. he highlights many of the same challenges you do.

http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=1237

>>> It's well established that the "Palestinian people" are a fiction that did not exist before 1947-8. The facts are plain about who these people were and are. You found a few Israeli apologists who disagree, but that doesn't change the reality. "Palestinians" are forever being used to threaten Israel, held up as eternal victims by the monarchs Israel's ongoing success has made fools out of for decades. Destroy Israel and give it to "Palestinians" tomorrow and they wouldn't know how to build a civilization.

>>> I am far from ignorant about what matters to me. Only the paranoid survive, and because the loudest mouthpieces of Islam are terrorists, and because the people who should be horrified by being represented by terrorists do little or nothing about it, they have been placed in the unenviable position of being forced to war against Western nations in a winner-take-all scenario.

>>> You wish to be a Gandhi for Islam and that is commendable. I maintain that the first people who would love to silence you are the Islamofascists, not Westerners, and certainly not me. A few million more like-minded gwaans might yield an Islamic country ready for the future. Good luck.