>> ^Aniatario:

Well on the bright side, I got myself a chapters gift card and I think I just might give Discworld a read.


Hey, how did the discworld reading go?

Thank you for the quality! I appreciate it.
In reply to this comment by Skeeve:
quality

heh, I was just reading The Science of Discworld: part II, The Globe by Terry Pratchett, Ian Stewart and Jack Cohen and it's all about STORIES that make up our world view - read it, it's funny, too

>> ^kceaton1:

I've seen Alzheimer's in action. It's perhaps the scariest thing I could get medically. This is from someone with cluster migraines. Loosing one's mind is a terrifying prospect.

My only memory of my grandmother is of this peculiar woman sitting in the corner of the room who never spoke a word and needed constant care. Truly there are worse things than death. At least Terry Pratchett poured a lot of himself into his books, he'll still be around long after he has departed.

^this should be a top rated comment... Incidentally, I am reminded of a famous quote that explains why the government funds the sciences...

"That's why it's always worth having a few philosophers around the place. One minute it's all Is Truth Beauty and Is Beauty Truth, and Does A Falling Tree in the Forest Make A Sound if There's No one There to Hear It, and then just when you think they're going to start dribbling one of 'em says, Incidentally, putting a thirty-foot parabolic reflector on a high place to shoot the rays of the sun at an enemy's ships would be a very interesting demonstration of optical principles." Terry Pratchett.

Now... if you please. I have to go back to my copper box and do some experiments before my wife (el biólogo) wakes up...

As an American raised on British comedy (Python, the Goodies, Douglas Adams, Terry Pratchett, Eddie Izzard, Ricky Gervais....) it appears that the strain of snobbery still runs deep in the English psyche. There seems to be a sense of entitlement among the upper class that its fine to be horribly rude to those you consider to be less educated. While the Cambridge-Oxford educated Python's took the upper class to task for this, I wonder if Ricky Gervais, who has working class roots, has affected this as a social climbing technique. He is very funny, and obviously very intellegent, but he is unbelievably cruel to Karl, and other people he considers to be friends. The woman and last man that Karl talks to treat him with the contempt that I find offensive.

In the second scroll of Wen the Eternally Surprised a story is written concerning one day when the apprentice Clodpool, in a rebellious mood, approached Wen and spake thusly: "Master, what is the difference between a humanistic, monastic system of belief in which wisdom is sought by means of an apparently nonsensical system of questions and answers, and a lot of mystic gibberish made up on the spur of the moment?" Wen considered this for some time, and at last said: "A fish!" And Clodpool went away, satisfied.
-- Terry Pratchett, "Thief of Time"

>> ^Aniatario:
"Maybe I just liked stirring"
I'm through talking to you. I've got better things to do on Christmas eve.


there has been no conversation

r10k has said nothing at all other than "its in the bible" and then every time sumone says what specifcly he just says its in the bible , the problem is there is no one way to interpret the bible so by saying "its in the bible " its utterly useless, its like me jumping in and saying ITS IN Harry potter and then sumone saying what is ? and my response is well your an idoit u have to read all 6 harry potter books to then potentially discover or not discover what im saying. so it basicly forces everyone to read harry potter rather than the person specifcly saying x,y,z is in there and then there bing a conversatoin on that.

An additional problem is that we know that the bible is not consistent contradictory and most probably not the word of god its allso not a scentific document and annyone could know to a reasonable probability having not evan read the book that its not the word of god. in the same way i know harry poter books are fictoin despite not having read them.

we also know that the majorty if not all philosophies and themes of the bible are taken from Manny pre existing philosophies and religions that are documented in older books than the bible .

In reply to this comment by r10k:
<After saying numerous times that I'm not going to attempt a spoon feeding session for people who prefer defending their set opinions ad infinitum, instead of simply reading a book, I'm not sure why that amuses you.



It's amusing because you say that the reason why Terry is wrong is very simple, but you won't give us the reason. Instead of defending your views of the bible, you spend all your effort and energy defending how it's our fault that you're not willing to reason. You tell us the answers are in the New Testament, which we can read for ourselves. Do you mean the parts in the New Testament that teaches masters how they should beat their slaves? Or the parts that tell slaves that they should obey their masters like they obey Christ? Do you selectively ignore these passages when you read the New Testament? Is that how you delude yourself into believing?


Wow, someone's been saving that last sentence for a special day. Terry would be proud.



I know, your own words sound pretty terrible when I throw them back at you eh:

>>"Mentality, your statement about selling daughters off into slavery is a great example of this. I'm mean really, if I have to explain that one to someone, they may as well permanently stamp an idiot tattoo to their forehead, it's so incredibly easy to understand, especially when it's spelt out in the equivalent of bright neon lights throughout the new testament."

In reply to this comment by dannym3141:
And as for you mentality - that's a hard one. Discworld of course are his best books (he has done some others), and within that series of books there are different spin-offs. Some are written from the perspective of the witches of discworld, some on the wizards (unrelated to the witches), some on the police, some are randomly based on a few individuals.

My dad started with the book about the police (or The Watch, as they're known in discworld). I let him start from the 1st book and he really didn't enjoy it, too fantasy for him, but fortunately he quickly realises comedy rather than fantasy is his niche. So while the very early books are a good read if/when you love discworld or fantasy, they're not always the best starting point.

I'd recommend therefore the City Watch books, as i did with my dad. They're an easy starting point. In order:
* Guards! Guards! 1989
* Men at Arms 1993
* Feet of Clay 1996
* Jingo 1997
* The Fifth Elephant 1999
* The Truth 2000
* Night Watch 2002
* Monstrous Regiment 2003
* Thud! 2005

I would recommend starting at the start if you mean to go on. The characters become more familiar and often you find the stories more sentimental and humorous if you know the characters. This list includes my top 3 favourite books of his, so definitely a good starting point. The books about Death (the character Death) are very good too.

Thanks for the recommendations!

In reply to this comment by r10k:
Mentality, your statement about selling daughters off into slavery is a great example of this. I'm mean really, if I have to explain that one to someone, they may as well permanently stamp an idiot tattoo to their forehead, it's so incredibly easy to understand, especially when it's spelt out in the equivalent of bright neon lights throughout the new testament.



You're right, it is incredibly easy to understand: the bible is a fake book written by men to reflect the traditions and social mores of that time period. And I totally agree, we should stamp idiot tattoos on the forehead of anyone who doesn't get it.

In reply to this comment by r10k:
Mentality, your statement about selling daughters off into slavery is a great example of this. I'm mean really, if I have to explain that one to someone, they may as well permanently stamp an idiot tattoo to their forehead, it's so incredibly easy to understand, especially when it's spelt out in the equivalent of bright neon lights throughout the new testament.



You're right, it is incredibly easy to understand: the bible is a fake book written by men to reflect the traditions and social mores of that time period. And I totally agree, we should stamp idiot tattoos on the forehead of anyone who doesn't get it.

>> ^spoco2:
"I would much rather be a rising monkey than a fallen angel"
Indeed Terry, Indeed.
I just don't get people who find it an affront to be descendant from apes


People would argue that humans are not descended from apes because apes exist, failing to realize many animals on earth have not adapted because there was no need for them to adapt. There is life in simplest form and life in complicated form.

>> ^r10k:
Terry is a legend, but it's amazing to me (again) that such respected people are so clueless about what the bible says. What isn't amazing to me is that every video with an anti-god sentiment made by a popular person (no matter the drivel it contains) speeds into the top 15.


You'd think there was some sort of trend to find out, huh?

>> ^r10k:
>> ^mentality:
>> ^spoco2:
Could you expand upon what you think he says here that is clueless about the bible?
Obviously Terry, or anyone else who doesn't believe in god, is clueless because he doesn't know how to properly pick and choose and selectively re-interpret the Bible to delude himself to believe in it. Because the Bible can't possibly be wrong, only our understanding of it.
Universe created in 7 days? Oh it's only a metaphor.
Fit all the species on a wooden boat? The boat was probably magical.
Explain how you should buy slaves? Oh God's probably just joking around.
Forbidden to eat shellfish? Yeah I'm not going to follow that one.
My favorite is the parts about selling your daughter off into slavery. Going to keep that one handy in case my daughter disobeys me.
On a serious note, I've never read his books. What's a good place to start?

The simple answer, spoco2, (so I don't waste my entire day trying to argue this stuff on here, the home of devout anti-christian fanatics) is that anyone who reads God as a maniac from the old testament just hasn't paid attention, stumbling at one of the most basic theological understandings. In other words, it's just plain missing the boat. It's like watching the first 30 seconds of a movie and trying to explain everything about it. People who do that are called idiots, and people who do the same with the bible get a similar title. It's just dumb, no matter which way you slice it, because you're obviously going to get stuff wrong. I don't expect everyone to decide on Christianity when reading the bible, but I expected more from Terry.
Mentality, your statement about selling daughters off into slavery is a great example of this. I'm mean really, if I have to explain that one to someone, they may as well permanently stamp an idiot tattoo to their forehead, it's so incredibly easy to understand, especially when it's spelt out in the equivalent of bright neon lights throughout the new testament.


R10k.

Do you reolise your rebuttal to sum one asking "please justify your opinion" was , "BECAUSE THE OTHER PERSON IS STUPID " you didn't provide anny data as to why your opinoin could be valid in anny way . ill show you why your response was useless.

1) "anyone who reads God as a maniac from the old testament just hasn't paid attention, stumbling at one of the most basic theological understandings."

please tell us why this is the case? why are they wrong ?just saying sum one that dose something is not getting it is hardly helping anyone understand annything.
if you believe the bible is the word of god then its pretty shitly written if the people it was written for cannot understand it , also who are you to say one person reads it right or wrong it seems that noone knows what the fuck the bible is meant to say because there are god knows how many churches and devisdoins of christainty all that read it differently.





2) at a guess based of what you typed i believe that you are adiment that the bible was written in a linear fashion with the start as a lesson and the end correcting that. as if it was written like a novel. ( as if some how reading the whole thing would give it sense )

the fundamental problem is that we know from historical data that the bible was written in a fragmented fashion by different people over different periods of time , and it was also rearranged repeatedly , we also know that the bible has Manny points where it makes no seance and that churches have edited what got included in the "bible" that we now know. (Evan if there was an original bible written in a correct intended order and structure we certainly don't have that now)


If you don't take the bible literally then how do you know what to take literally surly it makes more sence to believe that stoning homosexuals is something you should do and take litraly as we know homosexuals at least exsist. why not ignore the parts about god and prayer when we know in reality that there is no evidence that god exists , and it has been proven scientifically that prayer dose not work.

How do you know what is not literal and what is who are you to chose ?

If you take the bible literally why are you not out stoning gays and doing everything exactly as it is in the bible?