Unless they have intent to use them, or have knowledge that that’s what they’re made for, no? That’s what it says in the law, isn’t it?

“ Every person having upon him or her in his or her possession a picklock, crow, keybit, crowbar, screwdriver, vise grip pliers, water-pump pliers, slidehammer, slim jim, tension bar, lock pick gun, tubular lock pick, bump key, floor-safe door puller, master key, ceramic or porcelain spark plug chips or pieces, or other instrument or tool with intent feloniously to break or enter into any building, railroad car, aircraft, or vessel, trailer coach, or vehicle as defined in the Vehicle Code, or who shall knowingly make or alter, or shall attempt to make or alter, any key or other instrument named above so that the same will fit or open the lock of a building, railroad car, aircraft, vessel, trailer coach, or vehicle as defined in the Vehicle Code, without being requested to do so by some person having the right to open the same, or who shall make, alter, or repair any instrument or thing, knowing or having reason to believe that it is intended to be used in committing a misdemeanor or felony, is guilty of a misdemeanor. ”

I have this opinion, (that police (and some prosecutors) will ascribe intent to anyone in possession of any tools, even those with other uses, so they wouldn’t hesitate to do the same for tools that are clearly purpose built breaking and entering tools having been advertised as such and with no other use,) because I watched a friend be arrested in the 80’s for having a screwdriver and pliers in their backpack that the police called “burglary tools”. He did not have a history of burglary. The case was dropped when they instead charged him with <.5 grams of marijuana for some crumbs found loose in the bottom in his backpack and sent him juvie for 6 months. (I think he was on probation, I know the police wanted to charge him with anything….and did.). I was accused of having lockpicks once because I had picked up a few metal brush bits from a street sweeper in a parking lot and police saw me pick them up, arrested, then released me on site when the supervisor showed up and heard their story.

I think the last sentence of that paragraph puts him in danger, since he clearly has reason to believe at least some of the burglary tools he sells to the public are going to be used criminally.

I don’t want to see you give someone advice that could get them in serious trouble, I know you would feel terrible. You might be correct, technically without intent to commit a crime they’re legal to own, but in reality police and prosecutors decide your intent and I don’t trust them one whit.

Comment hidden because you are ignoring dag. (show it anyway)

3 seasons and a movie deal. Or was it 4?>> ^kymbos:

So it's back? I thought they were going to drop it.

Yeah, I figured it'd be a key sitting outside someone's house rather than a massive collection. But if they're this quick to dismiss the people's concerns with the FD, it's only a matter of time before they claim they're acting for the "citizen's safety" and give it to the PD.



<edit> I have no idea why this stuff is bolded</edit> >> ^NetRunner:

>> ^MarineGunrock:
@NetRunner - I think your idea of the fire chief or senior on duty having them would work if we weren't talking about hundreds of keys. First it's the FD, then city council says PD should have it, too. Then oh, what if you call because you're having a heart attack or stroke, so the EMTs need it too. Now we're REALLY starting to dilute the pool (lol, almost wrote 'poop') of people that have access to your key.

Well, it's not hundreds of keys. It's a key to a box outside with the keys in it. So one key. Granted, something of a master key, so you'd really want to keep good tabs on it.
FD/EMT are one and the same for this township, from what they said in the meetings. I'd join the protest of what city council is doing if they granted access to it to the PD.

>> ^MarineGunrock:

@NetRunner - I think your idea of the fire chief or senior on duty having them would work if we weren't talking about hundreds of keys. First it's the FD, then city council says PD should have it, too. Then oh, what if you call because you're having a heart attack or stroke, so the EMTs need it too. Now we're REALLY starting to dilute the pool (lol, almost wrote 'poop') of people that have access to your key.


Well, it's not hundreds of keys. It's a key to a box outside with the keys in it. So one key. Granted, something of a master key, so you'd really want to keep good tabs on it.

FD/EMT are one and the same for this township, from what they said in the meetings. I'd join the protest of what city council is doing if they granted access to it to the PD.

Ah, the world of double-standards.

I'd like to propose a metaphor:

When a key opens many locks, it's considered a master key.
When a lock is opened by many keys, it's a shitty lock.

Heh, every office has a master key ...

It's amazing to me that with all this technology, we still haven't come up with "teen keys", ie. Mom and Dad get a Master key while the teen gets a key that keeps the engine governed at 35 MPH. Sure, they'll complain but they can still make it to where they need to go via side streets and make it back alive. True, this doesn't curb bad driving habits but you'd see a drop in the amount of teen-related deaths due to such activities.

Ok.. since everything has to be explained in detail to you since you didn't see it on CSPAN the other night....

No.. the firefighters were not there when the first bomb went off as the janitor claims... but the janitor was leading the firemen up the tower in the stairwells because every other floor was locked and could only be opened with a master key that the janitor has (yes he still has it). By the time they got to the 34th floor they heard a series of explosions (that's a squadron of firefighters and the janitor)... not just one as you claim. Mr. Rodriguez has come forth with this information and testified before the 9/11 commission.. his testimony and any information about him was left out of the 9/11 commission report (it may be in the 28 page redaction). He has also been giving his testimony via various venues, but it's not widely publicised by the mass media.. however he did appear on Fox and MSNBC with a partial of his testimony, some of which was edited out.

Also, there is footage of explosions on video.. you need to do some more research. It's out there, but I'm about to make dinner and don't have time to look it for you.. do it yourself.

You should also watch the full testimony of Rodriguez that was aired on CSPAN - It's part of the American Perspectives series. If I ever see it released on You Tube, I'll post it.