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JAPR

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考えられなかった is practically a tongue twister, and I'm really rusty, lol. Thanks for the compliment.

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What impresses me more is hearing a person of English mother tongue pronouncing Japanese almost correctly! マジ感心.

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Bidouleroux said:

Someone is wrong on the Internet again, so here goes another long reply...

>> <a href='http://www.videosift.com/video/Noam-Chomsky-on-Pornography#comment-476516'>^spoco2</a>:
But, see, you're taking the stance that images or movies of people having sex is inherently wrong. WHY?

Where exactly do I say that? Please enlighten me. I took the time to define pornography as something that doesn't include the sexual images themselves and you somehow twist this and dare say that I think images and movies of people having sex are inherently wrong? Great non sequitur! Images of violence and criminality aren't inherently wrong either, but see, that doesn't mean violence and criminilaty themselves aren't wrong and that certainly doesn't mean that condoning violence and criminal behavior isn't wrong too. The latter point is the most relevant to pornography, since the sexual act itself isn't what is at stake here. But the act of pornography, defined to incorporate the objectification and degradation of women in a process of sexual gratification is inherently wrong, yes. If your images and movies do not objectify or degrade women for sexual gratification, then don't call it pornography.

Come on, if all the parties in the photos/videos are happy doing so, and no-one is hurt, no-one is treated badly, why is it wrong? Trying to build the fallacious argument that adult entertainment = violence and crime is ludicrous.

I am not equating "adult entertainment" to "violence and crime". Stop trying to subtly change the terms, you're not fooling anyone here (I would hope so). I am making an analogy between pornography and violence/crime. If you don't know the difference between "to equate" and "to make an analogy", I'm sorry for you.

Violence and crime are doing bad things to other people, pure pornography, just showing people having sex is not. It CAN be if the acts depicted are violent or degrading, but that's swinging back to the violence and crime angle. If what's displayed is two people enjoying being with each other, what is wrong with that in any society?

"Pure pornography" doesn't exist. It's your own little semantic wet dream. In any form of communication there is always a message that is inherent in the message itself, given by the outside context or a combination of both. When the context changes, for example when society evolves, the same message can mean other things that what was intended at first. Sade is a great example: condemned as immoral scum by even the most liberal representatives of the Enlightenment, he was then seen simply as a curious pathological case and then recently as a literary genius. Still, his books and their contents haven't changed in 200 years.

You seem to dislike sex because it's a primal' urge and therefore wrong... so, we shouldn't eat then? Or at least not enjoy eating? We shouldn't have sex at all then?
To try and suggest that a civil society has no enjoyment for the sake of enjoyment is missing the point of life.

I would suggest you acquaint yourself with the philosophy of Epicurus. Of course his views are dated now, but you could certainly use a confrontation with a well thought out viewpoint on pleasure and enjoyment that doesn't involve giving way to every desire that comes across your primitive mind.

If you start from the point of view that THERE IS NOTHING wrong with sex, then as long as all people involved in the creation of porn are happy and healthy and enjoying themselves, then THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH PORN.

Ok then, if I start from the view that THERE IS NOTHING wrong with lying (a natural action for all of us), then as long as all people involved in the creation of propaganda are happy and healthy and enjoying themselves, THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH PROPAGANDA? (and here I use propaganda in its pejorative sense, obviously) Your logic is spotless, but your premises are false.

It's just sad that there is a lot of mistreatment in the industry, but that doesn't mean the entire genre is wrong, just many of the people producing it.

The misapplying of an idea or concept by some individuals does not in anyway guarantee the correctness of that idea or concept. I do not see how you could present this blanket statement as an argument. The following is also not an argument concerning pornography by the way: "It's just fun that there is a lot of happiness in the industry, but that doesn't mean the entire genre is right, just many of the people producing it." You just threw something about pornography in the middle of something irrelevant about mistreatment in pornography. In other words, you've put a red herring in your straw man. Again, you're not fooling anyone.

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