Best post so far.

>> ^MaxWilder:

No damn reason? She tried to get away! Does that mean nothing to you?
You think complying with instructions from an officer of the law is the same as kissing their ass? You have a fucked up world view.
If an officer tells you to stop, you stop.
If an officer asks you a question, you reply with as much information you feel appropriate.
If an officer tells you to give identification, you politely ask what you are being charged with.
If an officer tells you what you are being charged with, you give identification.
If at any point you try to walk away, you are an idiot. If at any point you are rude or belligerent, you are an idiot.
This is not kissing ass. This is being respectful of the role in society that the officer plays. All you have to do is be polite. If that is difficult for you, that is your problem, not the officer's.
An officer is not under any kind of obligation, legally or morally, to show you more respect than you show him. Like I said before, if you comply with an officer's instructions and then you get beat, that is an entirely different story and I would be fully supportive of getting that officer fired and/or imprisoned. But that is not. what. happened. here. This is a video of two women who were disrespectful, unruly, tried to flee the scene, and laid hands on an officer while he was trying to do his job.

So what happens when the officer declines to tell you what you are being charged with? Do you refuse to give identification?

Also, you should always take advantage of your right to be silent.

>> ^MaxWilder:
No damn reason? She tried to get away! Does that mean nothing to you?
You think complying with instructions from an officer of the law is the same as kissing their ass? You have a fucked up world view.
If an officer tells you to stop, you stop.
If an officer asks you a question, you reply with as much information you feel appropriate.
If an officer tells you to give identification, you politely ask what you are being charged with.
If an officer tells you what you are being charged with, you give identification.
If at any point you try to walk away, you are an idiot. If at any point you are rude or belligerent, you are an idiot.
This is not kissing ass. This is being respectful of the role in society that the officer plays. All you have to do is be polite. If that is difficult for you, that is your problem, not the officer's.
An officer is not under any kind of obligation, legally or morally, to show you more respect than you show him. Like I said before, if you comply with an officer's instructions and then you get beat, that is an entirely different story and I would be fully supportive of getting that officer fired and/or imprisoned. But that is not. what. happened. here. This is a video of two women who were disrespectful, unruly, tried to flee the scene, and laid hands on an officer while he was trying to do his job.

Of course there is a serious problem with police misconduct. It's obvious from all the stories that have surfaced in the past couple decades. But it is utterly retarded to treat every cop who throws a punch the same way you would treat a cop who shoots unarmed suspects. Each situation must be analyzed separately.

If he had punched a girl who was cooperating, then of course I would be on your side, but she was trying to help a woman who was resisting arrest. Plain and simple.

If she was a ten year old, then of course I would be on your side, but she was a full grown woman even though she was technically under 18.

If this was any other situation and a man punched a woman, of course I would be on your side, but the police can NOT treat genders differently, or crazy girls like this will get away with whatever they want to do. The simple fact is that women can be a danger to police just like men, so they must be treated the same.

I just don't understand how you can possibly be on the side of the spoiled belligerent lawbreakers.

Now about the supposed "double standard" issue. I don't do that. I am a firm believer that the police should be the model of a law abiding citizen, and will not tolerate police who break laws. But that is simply not what happened here. He had every right to arrest the first girl, and he had every right to punch anybody who tried to prevent him from arresting the first girl.

In regards to the crowd, I really don't care if the crowd was not violent at that moment. The fact that the cop was surrounded by a crowd who was obviously on the side of the lawbreaker makes it a very dangerous environment. At any second, one of those people could have stepped in to assault the officer, and in fact that is exactly what happened. Now what if he was wrestling with two suspects (instead of beating one down quickly) and a third person steps in? That would be the end of him, and he knows it. He was having a difficult enough time with the first stupid girl, when the second girl assaulted him, he had to take her out of the equation fast.

Look, I am not a blind police supporter. In most of these videos, I am one of the people calling for heads to roll. I am sick of police brutality, but this is not one of those videos. This was a solitary, undertrained cop trying to do his job in the middle of a situation he is having a hard time controlling. It would be wonderful if we could "just get all officers better training". I would be fully in support of that. It doesn't change the fact that the level of force this officer used was appropriate. In fact, he was not using enough force on the girl he was originally trying to arrest, which directly led to the higher level of force he had to use on the second.

And yes, those of you who are outraged at this officer are making the situation worse. Get mad at the cops who shoot people first and ask questions later. Get mad at the cops who assault peaceful protesters. There are tons of videos out there where cops are abusing their authority that you should be outraged about. But when you get outraged at a cop who is trying to do what he is supposed to be doing, you are creating an atmosphere of disrespect that will lead to escalating violence. The video is, in fact, a perfect example. If they respected the officer who was doing his job properly, there would have been no violence at all.

There are times, in extreme circumstances, when resisting an unlawful arrest might be the right thing to do, but this is not one of them. In the vast, vast majority of cases you should simply take the citation and fight it in court. Resisting arrest is a crime, and on top of that it will make you look more guilty for whatever the cop is charging you. If you are caught in a situation where you did not break any laws, you best bet for getting out of trouble is to fully comply with the police.

Sigh. This is such a stupid argument. I can't believe there are so many people on the side of the morons who are trying to weasel out of a jaywalking ticket.

I don't know why your arguing about the jaywalking law. It's needed in certain places but everyone on earth knows you don't need to use force when applying that law.

If someone disrespects the cop while hes writing you a ticket or if that person is yelling at the cop that cop doesn't need to resort to force or start putting his hands on the person. It's bullshit that that's allowed and it's bullshit that if you pull away from that unnecessary force they are allowed to use even more force on you. And you get another added charge for resisting unnecessary force. ><

I get that the original girl walked away, so maybe he grabbed her and brought her back to the car. But clearly at the start of this video she isnt moving anyways and asking the officer to get the fuck off her, I think she says neck or hand, I dunno but you clearly see him grab her even more and push her against the car needlessly, she wasnt running or even trying to escape just being disrespectful. Which to cops = arrest/tase/manhandle. Once that happens she freaks out even more and tries to get his hands off of her in what seems to be a panic. The 17 year old sees this guy being overly aggressive with her friend and tries to break it up, but because cops cant handle disrespect and consider a touch to be fucking assault, she gets decked. fuck that.

That 17 year old was the only person with a backbone. The only person willing to defend a friend from needless aggression. For that she goes to jail.

With the reactions to cops in most communities - I mean look at the comments in the other video for instance - I can understand if he felt threatened when a crowd gathered around.

For once, this was a good cop in a bad situation, not a bad cop making a bad situation.

*quality

>> ^longde:

The officer wasn't alone.
The area was crowded with law-abiding citizens.
>> ^volumptuous:
btw: You can see the pedestrian overpass just in front of the cop car, that people are supposed to use to get to the other side of this street.
From what I've read, a lot of assholes in the area just jaywalk, and taunt cars as they do, so the local precinct decided to try to crack down on it, which leads us to this story.
Also in this video, you can clearly hear someone in the background saying "there's gonna be a riot right here". Real, real nice. I'll bet the officer was very happy to hear that, especially being alone.

>> ^blankfist:

For those of you who use the "but it's the law" argument, I'd like to remind you of a particular logical fallacy: Appeal to law.

I haven't seen anyone make the appeal to law fallacy. They would need to have said something that boiled down to "the officer was morally right to punch the girl, because the law permits it" for that fallacy to apply.

If you want to turn the argument into a discussion of whether it is moral for police officers to use force to complete an arrest of people who physically resist, knock yourself out, but simply talking about whether or not the officer's actions were within the law or not doesn't mean you are necessarily using fallacious reasoning.

BTW, that means it was a straw man fallacy you committed there. Way to go!

Damn, volumpy is straight up pimp. Rolling with the gang bangers and shit. Ducking drive-bys while he Sifts his videos. Yo, 50 Cent, how is the G-Unit these days? LOLZ.

He's so hardcore he be quoting some jaywalking death statistics, yo. Now that is street! Nevermind that these precious anti-jaywalking laws haven't prevented any jaywalking deaths, that would just be playa-hatin' on the laws, dog.

Bwahaha.

Oh, fucking put a sock in it BF.

Jaywalking in the US contributes to almost 5,000 deaths per year. And well over 7,000 serious injuries. Cops have to directly deal with this shit. Maybe you personally don't like the law (as well as every other law ever, unless Ron Paul says it's ok) but most people don't want to run over some kid who runs across the street unexpectedly.

A friend of mine killed three girls who ran across the street, drunk, at night, out of nowhere. Do you think he just loves living with this imagery for the rest of his life? Fucking hell man, that is just so wacked out. And to think this has anything to do with being black, or poor, or white cops abusing their power is so out of the ballpark you're playing the wrong game.

That is why we have these fucking laws.

And BF: Yes, I live in an incredibly gang-ridden neighborhood, with the Aves, Latin Kings and Dogtown killing eachother every weekend. Last weekend there were four homicides within six blocks of my house. When I lived in Detroit in the late 80's, I was in the extreme thick of it, and it was the fucking murder capital of the country. Maybe that doesn't sound like much to you, but why don't you fucking move over here for a week and see how your pasty-white valley ass deals with it.

Please, have some fucking perspective for once.

>> ^volumptuous:
I lived for years in downtown Detroit, and now I live in one of the most violent, gang ridden parts of Los Angeles. Please do NOT tell me anything about color prejudice or police conduct. It seems the one here with no experience with law enforcement, or gang voilence, are the ones so quick to point the finger at us.


Yeah, @longde, your opinion doesn't matter because Captain Experience over here has lived in LA! Volumptuous is from the streets, yo! Hahahaha. He's straight out of Compton! LOLZ!

Congratulations! Your comment has just received enough votes from the community to earn you 1 Power Point. Thank you for your quality contribution to VideoSift.

No shit?

3 years old = minor

But I think logical thinking people can agree that a 17 year old should be held more accountable for their own actions then a 3 year old.

>> ^longde:

17 years old = minor
In case you didn't know

I don't get why people are saying the crowd was unruly. They were just observing and only became loud after the punch, but even then seemed relatively calm. The girls were out of control, but a punch the face seems unnecessary because honestly the girls pushing up on him like they were wasn't a real threat to him. An obstruction? Possibly, but then wait for backup.

Also I don't understand why people are using the "it's the law" defense for the officer's actions. I get it's the law, but maybe that's part of the problem here? Sometimes laws are just dumb. If jaywalking is such a danger to society, I'd like to present NYC as an example how it's not. For those of you who use the "but it's the law" argument, I'd like to remind you of a particular logical fallacy: Appeal to law.

For those who say "don't resist arrest under any circumstances because it doesn't mean you're guilty", I tend to want to agree with you, but if you've ever spent a day on jury duty you'll know a large portion of the public believe arrests equate to guilt. This was just an unfortunate situation any way you slice it.

1- Of course not. It is well known and documented that police stop and harass people depending of factors such as color, where they live, class, etc. The drug war is a prime example of a set of laws that everyone breaks, but are selectively enforced. There are many others, if you want to get into it.

Ah, yes, LA, that epicenter of police justice. Home of dirty cops who make up evidence to convict folks. Didn't they recently have to overturn hundreds of convictions due to dirty cops' behavior?

>> ^volumptuous:
1- Bullshit point. Citing/ticketing a person for breaking the law happens on every "side of the track", or whatever you're calling it. In fact, this "side of the track" is the officers beat. This is where he is every day. These are the people he is served to protect.
2- If you read this thread, you'd see my earlier account of my friend being ticketed for this same thing. My friend is also white, blonde, blue-eyed and makes a lot of money. But, cops didn't care, they saw a guy jaywalking and pulled him over. He wasn't suckerpunched because I didn't try to intervene and then push the officer like the girl in this video!
3- One girl was 19. Not a minor. The other (who pushed him) is 17. You're treating them like they're 8 or 9 years old.
4- Someone in the crowd yelled out "there's going to be a riot, right here".
5- The officer needs more training in subduing a perp. Otherwise, he ended the situation appropriately.
6- I've been arrested three times in my life. I didn't fight back during any one of them, nor did I call the officers names, or try to run away.
I lived for years in downtown Detroit, and now I live in one of the most violent, gang ridden parts of Los Angeles. Please do NOT tell me anything about color prejudice or police conduct. It seems the one here with no experience with law enforcement, or gang voilence, are the ones so quick to point the finger at us.
I'm one of the first to point out police misconduct, and basically have very little respect for authority. But that disrespect doesn't make me blind and cry wolf every time a cop arrests someone.
btw: Longde - your post above shows exactly what happened. People were breaking the law, the cop tried to stop them, they resisted, one pushed the cop, the cop ended the situation. The end.
>> ^longde:
1) I think the girls were stupid and should be taught how to deal with officers who have no respect for your age or gender, especially if you live on the wrong side of the tracks
2) I just can't imagine this happening to some of the skinny blonds I knew in high school, some of whom were just as crazy. I can't see them being suckerpunched. can you?
3) Despite some of you wanting to make an exception for these girls because they don't fit the phenotype you prefer, they are kids and minors, with the same mentality as such. It absolutely does matter in this situation.
4) The crowd was not hysterical, not a mob, not a riot. Look at their behavior, not their skin color. They were very restrained, not physically interfering at all. Just paying attention and recording to make sure this didn't turn into another 'accidental' cop murder. Given the history of cops, I can't blame those folks for being wary.
5) The officer obviously needs more training. To let a jaywalking infraction escalate into punching a 17 year old girl is unacceptable.
6) You law and order types would not be quiet and respectful if you thought some officer arresting you was in the wrong. You feel the way you do because you seldom encounter aggressive cops. Well, some people deal with that type everyday.

1- Bullshit point. Citing/ticketing a person for breaking the law happens on every "side of the track", or whatever you're calling it. In fact, this "side of the track" is the officers beat. This is where he is every day. These are the people he is served to protect.

2- If you read this thread, you'd see my earlier account of my friend being ticketed for this same thing. My friend is also white, blonde, blue-eyed and makes a lot of money. But, cops didn't care, they saw a guy jaywalking and pulled him over. He wasn't suckerpunched because I didn't try to intervene and then push the officer like the girl in this video!

3- One girl was 19. Not a minor. The other (who pushed him) is 17. You're treating them like they're 8 or 9 years old.

4- Someone in the crowd yelled out "there's going to be a riot, right here".

5- The officer needs more training in subduing a perp. Otherwise, he ended the situation appropriately.

6- I've been arrested three times in my life. I didn't fight back during any one of them, nor did I call the officers names, or try to run away.

I lived for years in downtown Detroit, and now I live in one of the most violent, gang ridden parts of Los Angeles. Please do NOT tell me anything about color prejudice or police conduct. It seems the one here with no experience with law enforcement, or gang voilence, are the ones so quick to point the finger at us.

I'm one of the first to point out police misconduct, and basically have very little respect for authority. But that disrespect doesn't make me blind and cry wolf every time a cop arrests someone.


btw: Longde - your post above shows exactly what happened. People were breaking the law, the cop tried to stop them, they resisted, one pushed the cop, the cop ended the situation. The end.



>> ^longde:

1) I think the girls were stupid and should be taught how to deal with officers who have no respect for your age or gender, especially if you live on the wrong side of the tracks
2) I just can't imagine this happening to some of the skinny blonds I knew in high school, some of whom were just as crazy. I can't see them being suckerpunched. can you?
3) Despite some of you wanting to make an exception for these girls because they don't fit the phenotype you prefer, they are kids and minors, with the same mentality as such. It absolutely does matter in this situation.
4) The crowd was not hysterical, not a mob, not a riot. Look at their behavior, not their skin color. They were very restrained, not physically interfering at all. Just paying attention and recording to make sure this didn't turn into another 'accidental' cop murder. Given the history of cops, I can't blame those folks for being wary.
5) The officer obviously needs more training. To let a jaywalking infraction escalate into punching a 17 year old girl is unacceptable.
6) You law and order types would not be quiet and respectful if you thought some officer arresting you was in the wrong. You feel the way you do because you seldom encounter aggressive cops. Well, some people deal with that type everyday.

The officer wasn't alone.

The area was crowded with law-abiding citizens.
>> ^volumptuous:
btw: You can see the pedestrian overpass just in front of the cop car, that people are supposed to use to get to the other side of this street.
From what I've read, a lot of assholes in the area just jaywalk, and taunt cars as they do, so the local precinct decided to try to crack down on it, which leads us to this story.
Also in this video, you can clearly hear someone in the background saying "there's gonna be a riot right here". Real, real nice. I'll bet the officer was very happy to hear that, especially being alone.