Also, I think a post-rapture world would be paradise on earth.

@shveddy

""Oh yea, and I'm sick and tired of Christians always excusing themselves from the need for behavioral and moral superiority by saying that only Jesus is perfect, thinking that it will alleviate all of my complaints about Christianity.

I have no more problem with the hypocracy of Christians than I do with anyone else who makes mistakes and does bad things while generally saying that he or she is a good person. Which is to say that I don't stress over it very much because we all do it.""

Christians, in general, should stand out from the rest of the world if they are living according to what Christ taught. If they are indistinguishable from everyone else, they are definitely not following His teachings. I wasn't excusing anyone however, I was simply stating that Christians are still human and will make mistakes.

""What drew me away from religion is that the Father, Jesus and particularly the Holy Spirit are especially vile concepts that are in no way deserving of my respect. So stop trying to defend Christians when I don't care to condemn their behavior very much.

Explain to me how a just god can create a world that, upon close examination of its workings, clearly disagrees with nearly all of the specifics claimed by that god's supposed divine revelation.""

When God created the world, it was "very good". It had no death, and no pain. It was a paradise and humans enjoyed direct fellowship with God. The reason that the world is embroiled in evil today is because God gave human beings free will, to obey or disobey His commands. It is because of our disobedience towards God that sin and death entered the world. Creation fell because of the sin of man, and we became spiritually separated from God.

""Tell me then, how a good god can come up with a rather ambiguous way to save his sinning inhabitants (that he created) that can be summarized in an arbitrary phrase that does nothing but allow people to shirk responsibility for actions. And then, despite having the power to move everyone to accept this gift, decides to give it only to a select few based mostly on geography.""

God hasn't chosen a select few to be saved. He desires all to come to repentence and receive eternal life. God gives everyone the opportunity to be saved, but people choose to suppress the truth God has revealed to them because of wickedness. When you look at someone across the world, locked into false religion, what you don't see are all the choices that God has offered that person to draw near to His Son. You don't see what could have been, you only see what is. The gospel is preached in every country in the world, and where it hasn't reached, people receive dreams and visions. God can reach anyone.

Neither is salvation based on an "arbitrary phrase". You say you left religion..so were you a Christian? If so, how is it that you don't know how people are saved? Do you understand the gospel?

You are saved when you accept Jesus Christ into your life as Lord and Savior, when you believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, and confess Him as Lord. It has nothing to do with words, it has to do with the sincere intent of your heart.

Neither is an effort to shirk personal responsibility. On the contrary, we are personally responsible to God for all of the sins we have committed. God has commanded that all people everywhere *repent* of their sins, and trust in His Son. That is a total fulfillment of personal responsibility, as we are accountable to God and not men.

God does not force anyone to come to Him; He gives you a choice. Neither is it a bunch of words, where you simply believe what the bible says. The gospel comes by the *power* of the Holy Spirit. When you believe, you are born again as a new person, and you receive the Holy Spirit, who lives within you. It is a supernatural transformation of your entire being.

""Oh, and by the way. Christianity is a religion by definition. According to the Oxford dictionary, a religion is "the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods."

For you to claim that Christianity is not a religion than in order to not qualify under the accepted definition, you would have to deny the following:

1. That you believe in God and Jesus
2. That you worship God and Jesus
3. That God is superhuman and capable of controlling
4. and that God or Jesus are personal to you

Somehow I doubt that you deny those. If you feel like denying the authority of the oxford dictionary, then feel free to look ridiculous.""

Under that definition, it is technically a religion, but not as you understand it. When you think of religion, you think of dogma and rituals. That isn't what Christianity is; at its foundation, it is nothing more or less than a personal relationship with the Creator of the Universe. That is not religion as how an atheist understands the word.

Canada threatens Dick Cheney's personal safety? Sounds like paradise! Glad I'm moving there now

>> ^FlowersInHisHair:

You think that Britain is socialist!?
>> ^quantumushroom:
I thought socialism would have turned England into a utopian paradise by now!



He knows it in his heart and that's what counts!

>> ^quantumushroom:

I thought socialism would have turned England into a utopian paradise by now!


How can Britain be socialist? They invented the term "class system".

A socialist nation with an enfranchised church and a hereditary monarch as head of state? Pull the other one.
>> ^quantumushroom:

Yeah, it's socialist. Not quite Cuba, but still...
The English are denied the right to defend their lives with firearms. There's cameras everywhere keeping everyone "safe". Freedom of speech has been shackled a hundred times over. When a government owns your health, it owns YOU.
The welfare state continues unabated. Please take Obama as a parting gift, we'll throw in Biden for free.

>> ^FlowersInHisHair:
You think that Britain is socialist!?
>> ^quantumushroom:
I thought socialism would have turned England into a utopian paradise by now!

Yeah, it's socialist. Not quite Cuba, but still...

The English are denied the right to defend their lives with firearms. There's cameras everywhere keeping everyone "safe". Freedom of speech has been shackled a hundred times over. When a government owns your health, it owns YOU.

The welfare state continues unabated. Please take Obama as a parting gift, we'll throw in Biden for free.


>> ^FlowersInHisHair:

You think that Britain is socialist!?
>> ^quantumushroom:
I thought socialism would have turned England into a utopian paradise by now!

You think that Britain is socialist!?
>> ^quantumushroom:

I thought socialism would have turned England into a utopian paradise by now!

I thought socialism would have turned England into a utopian paradise by now!

I have to agree with Santorum. Can you imagine what a socialist paradise the new communist America would be if everyone was a professor of constitutional law?

@renatojj

I never claimed Sweden was a socialist paradise. Merely that it is on the left of most developed nations and the US is to the right. The US is doing terribly in almost every measurable category of public success, Sweden is one of the best in nearly every category of success.

This trend goes across the board. Countries where corporations are kept in check and wage disparity (after taxes) is lowest do the best, the middle of the road countries fare moderately well and those countries (like the US) that fall to the far right of the spectrum fare worst.

Whether Sweden has swung to the right or the left relative to themselves in recent years is totally irrelevant. But thanks for trying to avoid the real issue again. Why don't you try addressing it instead?

The real problem is extremism. Did Sweden swing too far one way and bring themselves back? Probably. Is that a good reason to take the extreme opposite view and claim that any tax is a bad tax, any government intervention is bad intervention and corporations will do what's right without all that red tape getting in their way? Absolutely not.

Boo! "Sour grapes" is not an argument!

Being Finnish, I love to hear people denigrate Sweden. So in the interest of further discourse, I apologize for calling you a stinky-poopoo-face.
>> ^renatojj:

I could say a quite few things to shake your view of Sweden as the socialist paradise you think it is, but would that make any difference at this point?

@Drachen_Jager, like I said, I don't have the time to address your every misconception, I could say a quite few things to shake your view of Sweden as the socialist paradise you think it is, but would that make any difference at this point? Really? You don't seem very open-minded about political discourse to me, or respect my opinion that much anyway.

What seems lost in translation for the left is, the "evil" corporations as well as the little guys have little choice but to ALL have lobbyists pursuing their own interests. Why?

Because government is too large and too powerful.

You can take your pick of which is the greater evil: 'greedy' corporations which can and do fail, or a permanent class/army of government bureaucrats untied to quality performance or market demand, and which has lobbyists to shame even the corporations.

I'd rather take my chances with the market.






>> ^westy:

>> ^quantumushroom:
People who get "free" stuff usually like things being "free", and a corrupt government is more than happy to seize the money from the producers to buy the votes of the ignorant. Why should the producers continue busting a$$ only to have their 'extra' hard work taken away? Socialist paradises like mexifornia have been great for Utah and Arizona, which are more than happy to receive the fleeing companies voting with their feet.
Europe is in deep sh1t because of socialism, which sooner than later always fails. Even if you could tax everyone at 98% the unlimited wants of the people would outrun any government's ability to redistribute wealth.
Capitalism works, socialism 'sort of' works until it's literally too big NOT to fail.

Europe is in deep shit because USA DEREGULATED THE MARKETS and the whole of europe and USA are all tied into the same big banks.
In reality we live in a coperate run socity and thats because for the most part its a FREE MARKET in the sense that whoever has the most money can do what the fuck they like by lobying the goverment thats what you get when you let companies and money dictate things the people with the money own and run the goverment its as close to free market as you can get and hense why everything has fallen apart for the menny and benofited the few super ritch.
also look at crime rates and quality of helth care for countries that have better distribution of wealth you will find they are among the top.