I only have one request: re-read your last paragraph, would you kindly, and (if you can put up with this strange man's problems imposed on your precious persona a little while longer), please explain what, in your opinion, applying separate sets of standards to oneself and others' in communication and decision making and assuming one is perfect, tells about a human being.

I can only speculate you might either realize you've edited your reply too much and misconstrued the meaning you intended for it to convey or else find yourself to be the one that judges others from afar and from a moral high-ground.

Finally, a word of advice - do try and invest even small amounts of time and sift a couple of videos. Just look at how it benefited our own Bill O'Reilly - from being a Siftiversally acknowledged troll on the verge of Banination he's gone to being known as a more eloquent, right-wing younger version of Choggie. I'd very much like to see you try and rectify your perceived status in this community.

In reply to this comment by LittleRed:
No, I didn't miss her response at all. And that would've been fine if it had been left at that. She asked him to come in and protect her from the mean boy, and that's when it got out of hand. So maybe she did respond to moodonia herself - she also didn't leave it at that. It's her fault this all happened in the first place.

You can think what you will about my love life. It's perfectly healthy and I'm signing a lease with my boyfriend tomorrow. Just because I am disgusted by public displays of affection does not at all mean I don't know love. I just feel it should be a private affair. No one else needs to know the intricacies of your relationship - it's disgusting. Again, there's nothing wrong with the way Dag and Persephone or Issy and DFT interact on here. I much prefer that to what I've seen with others.

You're right. It was blown out of proportion - but not by moodonia or me. Karkarlee asked ObsidianFire to confront moodonia publicly, and he did so. THAT was the problem. I didn't claim to be the moral police, nor was I the only one that had a problem with the situation. I just may have been more vocal than others. And in case you hadn't noticed, I am oh so very worried about creating "long-term problems" on a website that I can choose to frequent as often as I like.

I don't have a problem with the way I act, and neither does anyone I care about. I will make my own decisions, and I don't need opinions of a strange man who obviously doesn't make perfect decisions himself. [Married at 20, maybe.] When you're perfect, then by all means interject your opinion on my actions. Until then, please keep to judging me from afar.

No, I didn't miss her response at all. And that would've been fine if it had been left at that. She asked him to come in and protect her from the mean boy, and that's when it got out of hand. So maybe she did respond to moodonia herself - she also didn't leave it at that. It's her fault this all happened in the first place.

You can think what you will about my love life. It's perfectly healthy and I'm signing a lease with my boyfriend tomorrow. Just because I am disgusted by public displays of affection does not at all mean I don't know love. I just feel it should be a private affair. No one else needs to know the intricacies of your relationship - it's disgusting. Again, there's nothing wrong with the way Dag and Persephone or Issy and DFT interact on here. I much prefer that to what I've seen with others.

You're right. It was blown out of proportion - but not by moodonia or me. Karkarlee asked ObsidianFire to confront moodonia publicly, and he did so. THAT was the problem. I didn't claim to be the moral police, nor was I the only one that had a problem with the situation. I just may have been more vocal than others. And in case you hadn't noticed, I am oh so very worried about creating "long-term problems" on a website that I can choose to frequent as often as I like.

I don't have a problem with the way I act, and neither does anyone I care about. I will make my own decisions, and I don't need opinions of a strange man who obviously doesn't make perfect decisions himself. [Married at 20, maybe.] When you're perfect, then by all means interject your opinion on my actions. Until then, please keep to judging me from afar.

In reply to this comment by EDD:
Unfortunately, you obviously missed karkarlees initial response to moodonia. Yeah, and by the way - it was there before obsidianfire joined in. She did respond to him herself and did it well.

Also, seeing as how you don't grasp the idea of protectionism (mild jealousy) in a relationship and cuddling over the internet (it happens in text messages, too, you know), I'm inclined to believe you've not known love. Possibly you're/have been in one of those arranged relationships, in which at least one partner's faking it for their benefit. I wouldn't know and I'm not assuming anything beyond a simple reason for your complete inability to empathize in this situation. Yes, and it does speak volumes about your character, as does the fact that you've know referred to yourself as 'bitch' a couple of times. One might almost think karkarlee's not really the one with problems of self-respect/confidence.

And of course they had a problem with this mess. You and moodonia (unexpected of him) blew it out of proportions. Even if stuff's in writing (and oh noes, on the inhumane internet), YES, it can still offend anyone. So you'll be the moral police, telling everyone off when they raise objections towards what somebody's saying? It was still a discussion and it wasn't like Obsidianfire petitioned to have modoonia banned. If you've not realized it yet, the only one having/creating long-term problems here for themselves and others was you, and you did it on purpose, so don't bitch about it now, please.

Anyway, nice job on your attempts to reform a woman who's not as blunt and hardened as you are by being mean to her and her boyfriend for no real reason other than your dislike towards their type of relationship. Oh, and do inform me on how that attitude of yours of carrying out acts of disruptive behavior in internet/social communities/societies and not answering to anyone other than yourself works out in the future, will you?

Best of luck, Ed.

In reply to this comment by LittleRed:

I am not a snob; I am a woman. I am strong and I speak my mind. People who promote the "women are weak! Rescue them!" stereotype disgust me. I also realize that I am a bitch. I am generally told so on a weekly basis. I'd rather be a bitch than allow someone to walk all over me, or have a man speak for me.

I understand my opinion means a lot less to people [less than if I were polite] because I'm a bitch. I get it. But I would respect a bitch over someone who won't even address a stranger to say "Hey, this makes me uncomfortable," and sends her boyfriend in to mess things up.

If comments from guys on the internet offend you, you have a problem. If you can't even say to the offender "Hey, I don't really appreciate being hit on; would you mind not doing that again?" for fear of not being taken seriously, you need some counseling in self-worth. How to stand up for yourself. If you have a history of doing this kind of thing, even more so. If you send your internet boyfriend in to "clean up the mess" only to not back him up when he starts a shit storm, that's a problem. If you think the original comment is sexual harassment, you have a serious problem.

It's obvious to even a blind person that the two are dating. They spread their stickily sweet lovey-dovey relationship on every comment written, every blog post, even their profile. Maybe internet relationships just have to communicate their attachment to everyone in fear the next internet girl or guy will steal their partner away? I don't understand the meaning behind that, and I do find it curious that the only two couples on here who aren't content with making the occasional comfortable relationship comment (i.e. Issykitty and DFT OR laura and DonJuan, OR Dag and Persephone) are long-distance, on another continent couples. Ugh. That aside, it's obvious they're dating. Anyone who makes a comment like "Maybe we should talk" is OBVIOUSLY not intending that as a pick-up line, especially with a militant boyfriend around the corner.

If you want to label me as a feminist, I will proudly accept that label. However, unlike some, I don't want to give a bad name to feminists for my views. By that, I mean I don't speak for anyone else or females in general when I say what I do. I think it's disgusting that she's running to someone else to do her dirty work, and even blames that on the fact that she's female and has had less-than-perfect interactions with men in the past. Do I scorn her for showing "feminine" traits in this situation? If you want to consider those "feminine traits," be my guest. I see weakness and a complete lack of self-respect, or self-confidence. She purports to be extremely confident in her relationship, to the point that she allows her boyfriend, as long as he's on another continent, to watch porn. [Considering that's the way their relationship is, fine. But when her views on porn in anything other than a long-distance relationship are the same or similar to the ones thepinky and I were trying to share, she shouldn't have acted so self-righteous.] Yet at the same time, she's not comfortable enough to have a strange guy make a perfectly innocent, somewhat flirtatious comment, and neither is her boyfriend.

In addition, I do not "continuously troll a website with [my] snide comments." Sure, I may contribute a snide comment on occasion - the only two I can think of outside this discussion are the comment to LadyDeath about how she should apologize for quoting thepinky on the porn thread, and to K0MMIE when he attacked me in his post on the same topic. No, I may not contribute much video-wise. As I've said before, I joined for the discussion; I'm not a vote whore. In topics that are not emotionally charged or sexist, my comments are well-thought-out and generally appreciated. I have several comments from the first few months I joined that, if the comment voting system had been in place, I would have a star by now. Sure, maybe that doesn't negate the fact that what I have said recently, some people may consider out of line. Then again, I don't have to answer to anyone but myself.

H.R. 1955: Violent Radicalization and Homegrown Terrorism Prevention Act of 2007
-http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=h110-1955

Sorry admins. In your desperate attempt to please all of the people, all of the time, you ignore a fundamental law of the universe...that it is in a constant state of flux, chaos, and disorder, as much as you would like to see things (idol worship of mammon) flow progressively forward, you follow the same flawed model that has made some of the most dangerous individuals on the planet, the most inebriated with power consolidation and empire, into the neuvo-hitleresque herders, who have been granted license by the herd, to place rings in noses, and meat in corrals....as many as they see fit, to improve upon their totalitarian tactics, with a view to world domination.

You think that it is fantasy, the ramblings of perceived deranged and damaged minds....once you give in to the radical fringe's demand for "justice", you open the way to all manner of coop, control, enslavement, fear, and death.

Projected onto the internet dynamic, is may seen in the plethora of tunnel-reality blogs, the very beasts you seek to break from with this project....it is not reasonable, that one person, or group of persons, fueled by their emotional, irrational demands for "absolute fairness", should dictate...cloaked in what appears to be simple courtesy, respect, and the absence of ill-will or"hate" towards individuals, is the me me me me screaming, of an un-actualized, ego-driven child, screaming for the sake of screaming, in order to impose their will over all, and all the while, the only entitlement they truly have, has been stolen from them at birth by the grinch, and returned to them looking nothing like xmas.

Only the admins and these demanding children know who these vermin are, (ohhhh, was that hate speech??, go back to elementary school, motherfuckers!) but be damn these weaklings, vampires, and energy suckers. The only thing that will be missed, as these leech-like patrons come and go, is another juvenile link, some borrowed flavor-of-the-week diatribe about racism, fascism, or equal rights for the batshit-insane...and as sure as they leave, another will pop up in their place, devoid of anything but a pom pom and bullhorn for the home-team(prevailing, superficial yet destructive dogma, place in their minds by their programmers)And that is what prompted this post...some pm's to admins by a minority fringe, most likely some of the more vocal up-and-comers, who in their passion for promulgating fairness and love, non-hate and flowers, are really just screaming, "Listen to me and do what I say!!"...

"That's trying a bit too hard to make our attempted assistance for community safety/well-being seem like the work of the Gestapo, especially when this change does not harm anyone in any possible way."

funny lucky, you described in that statement, one of the fundamental flaws of not learning from history's mistakes....("we are only trying to help you, why are you so mad?..this can't possibly be bad, if on the surface, it looks simple and natural??")"what does "harm" mean in the context of that sentence? Rationalizations like these, are why the world is going down the shit-hole, at break-neck speeds.

but don't mind me, I am simply an observer...trapped in a world I never made.

>> ^gorgonheap:
Yes yes, ALL religions PUSH there ideals on people. Are you serious? You base your judgments off religious extremism and not the overwhelming majority? Bill Maher is taking a small cancerous part of religion and making it into a mountain of evil.


When the Moral Majority and such made a lot of noise years ago I thought the same way, but rather than act like the fringe I thought they were they and their type gained a bunch of power over the years. When they put a President in office who started to mix Federal money with faith based programs and the reports we've heard from our military schools started coming out I was getting pretty concerned that it was getting out of hand. And when they got more and more vocal about Constitutional amendments to bring law into line with the bible then they managed to get gay marriage amendments passed in multiple States it stopped looking much like a fringe. It takes majorities to pass those laws, if they could pass those it's time to stop ignoring the other threats from them as well.

If there actually is some rational 'overwhelming majority' it's about time they stood up and got heard. Don't fuck with my Constitution for religions reasons and I won't fuck with your religion. Start to look like a threat and we'll have to deal with it somehow.

Thanks to fissionchips for pointing this thread out to me! I haven't been too busy sifting lately so my queue isn't full, but my goodness... you guys make up one of my favorite communities, on and off line! I'm kinda quiet on here mostly because I am more of a peace lover than a storm brewer, but if it weren't for the more vocal people on here I don't think this would be as fun. I aspire to the heights of wit, humor and intellect displayed by my peers. Thanks for the kudos! (now that my lips are all chapped I will end this little speech with that)

Hey, no need to apologize, buddy. I know I was one of the more vocal ones for getting rid of it, but I wasn't offended by it. Like I said, I thought it was hilarious, but I just feel like we need to make sure to keep clear distinctions and maintain the rules.

Also, as a fellow man who sees the same thing wrong with a lot of sites on the internet, I see a lot of *quality in your explanation and apology.

1) "videos being viewed right now" might be disposable.
As the traffic increases, it becomes irrelevant to the point of being "here's some random videos, yay" ...that some random people happen to be watching... It might be worth extending the "new sift-talk posts" panel to include all channel sift-talk posts in place of the "videos being viewed right now."

2) With everyone on broadband, we might up the default vids/page to 20 and top 15 to top 20. This can also allow the additional channel Sift-talk posts in the side-bar.

3) I wouldn't mind giving the "diamonds" the ability to * destroy a vid from the deadpool if it is obviously one of those ones that will never come back, e.g. simpsons or anything comedy central. We don't need to continually seek ways to avoid the law and their copyright permissions to keep 1 minute videos circulating on the sift "illegally." If "destroyed," they're gone from the deadpool and people can re-submit them anyway if the legal issues get sorted out in the future.

Encouraging more commenting and Sift-talk participation might make the community more vocal. For now, we have a very limited group of regular vocal posters. As much as I enjoy the "small group" mentality, it doesn't support dissension very well. I guess I'm concerned about the sift just becoming another marginal and unimportant one-sided group-think forum. If everyone thinks the same way and they all only let certain vids through, then it's not what it seems it was meant to be and it loses HALF its potential audience. It'll just be another Drudge or Moveon. Encouraging commenting by some means might incite some better 2-sided discussions.

This roasting situation is static, so swampgirl, m'self, and dotdude are the only real enthusiasts so far, for real. It would be a tragedy, to half-assed begin this thing, without setting down some guidelines.

My gut feeling is, that folks are not eager to roast such a sticky-bun sweet, never say anything bad about anything, floppy-eared dog-lover, mommy-type,OR, they are worried about offending someone. Another reason, for less than enthusiastic support, may simply be y'all think its too difficult or silly to attempt-I say pooh, after you see one in parody, for the perusal of all, the bandwagon will be much better for the next one.



Swampgirl has volunteered to un-volunteer as first roastee....we both think it fitting to elect (or have a volunteer) someone more....un-cutesy, with a few more...raw edges, ripe for lampooning or destroying utterly-

I have my own wannabees, Sg has suggested some of the more vocal folks on the sift, and my offer still stands to be the guinea pig-Ya's trash me alla time anyhow, so why not wave yer aversion to ad-hom officially, and join the "take choggie down" bandwagon....give it a try, you may turn Born-Again ass-handers, after the rave reviews from folks who would rather watch a good tussle, instead of taking part.

Now-everyone rally back on this post-DOTDUDE if you would be so kind, as to discard, or otherwise consolidate the other 2 posts, regarding the roast, as noit to confuse folk-?


*Whomever is interested in taking part in the roast, please bookmark this page, so we can get a count!!!

The problem Skeeve is that the close-minded individuals you refer to who are more fundamentalist/absolutist in their Christian beliefs are the more vocal.

I don't think this video is particularly demeaning of religion on the whole - it's simply pointing out the idea of Hell was never a logically sound justification for practicing religion, given certain conditions on the concept of a omnipotent, omniscient "God." The speaker's argument is by no means new or innovative, these arguments have existed for hundreds of years. He very nearly recites the Epicurean Paradox word for word.

Absolutely, there are many other reasons to practice religion, and certainly science and religion can coexist. It's when people start blindly accepting translated texts written thousands of years ago by fallible, mortal individuals that problems occur (yes, I mean "faith"). Don't take offense to "religion-bashing" sifts overmuch, because this sift in particular is pretty tame compared to the religious zealots I encounter daily telling me that I am going to Hell.

Ok, I just read those comments and that is what we call a debate, while westy may not be as eloquent as some he is just trying to get his point across. Now this person who emailed and said the comments are "absolutely shocking in their rabid, nearly psychotic intolerance." is way out in left field. So far out in left field that it makes me wonder if they are just trying to squash the opinions that are not in line with their own.

Is westy intolerant of religion? no more so than if the shoe was on the other foot. I am sure westy is more intolerant than some, and not as much as others, it comes with the territory.

I am an atheist and didn't start calling myslef one until about 2 years ago, but I have known it all my life. I went to church every Sunday and went to Sunday school and was even baptised. For as long as I can remember I have always perceived religion as a cult. Now over the past few years with the proliferation of people who feel like I do taking it to the net with videos and forums, you are getting a lot of people who call themselves atheists becoming more and more vocal. This scares a lot of people and thus you get counter videos and stuff like godtube, etc. I can see how some atheists try to shout loudly from the rooftops to get their point across, because to us the idea if religion is rather silly and the fact that we watch it as it permeates our life, government, schools, etc is rather frightening. So you get very vocal and somewhat intolerant opinions. To me I can see how it appears to be a battle and I can understand why there is intolerance from the atheist perspective, I can also see how the religious side feels the same way towards us. But the bottom line is it should be ok for me or westy or whoever to say that we feel someone is off their fucking rocker to believe a certain way and why we think that. That being said I am tolerant of religion as long as it doesn't try to effect my way of life, make rules for me, get tought to my kids without my knowledge, and shove it's opinions on me when I don't care to hear it. And I try to do the same to those who have faith, I do not go around spouting my non-beliefs to people around me because to do so would be hypocritical.
I would like to think the two sides can live together and respect each others turf, not sure it will happen anytime soon though.

Any preeminent religion gets a bad rap when it flexes, or when the fringes become more vocal that the majority...this bothers me though...
"If the word 'Muslim' was replaced with 'black' these people would have been kicked off the Sift long ago."
not the same amimal, mate.....s'either about stereotyping by race or religion...I can't help I'm black, I can't keep that to myself.....Atheists are no different than Christians or Muslim,s in their zeal, conviction, and faith-
I see no difference, the mechanism is the same....

The fundamental differences in human beings are minimal...perception is the mother of most egos...
Leggo my egos..

Ahhhhh, the many shades of dysfunction, the legion of cries from the souls of the damned....so many more to come one might say, given the extinction of positive male role models. Is it no wonder that there are so many more vocal homosexuals on the planet than sayyyyyyy 20 YEARS AGO!???
His fifteen minutes of coming out combined with fleeting fame and obscurity.....Please help him, donate your sympathies and pity to:
This Guy's Address
666 Loser Ln.
Anytown, USA 23623