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What "defund the police" really means

bcglorf says...

Apologies, didn't mean to misrepresent you. We've debated things before and you seemed to lean to no cop is a good cop because there are so many bad ones guilt be association and failure to clean things up makes them all bad. You'd also said up thread to fire all active officers.

I'll cease trying to word how you feel on it, I just wanted to demonstrate by counter example that not everybody means 'reform' when they say "defund". At a minimum , the degree of 'reform' varies from change some laws and regulations to fire them and start over from scratch.

My comment of being ruled by our 'betters' was meant as a sarcastic dig on them and their abject failure in letting things rot this far and doing nothing.

Finally, my comment on public opinion on solutions being non-uniform was mostly to emphasize that as just normal, and the current status quo is just so unacceptable that it is unifying people from varied points of view to stand up against it. The most important point being that declaring, see nothing will satisfy the mob because they can't agree what to do is a twisted deception and the truth is people want things to be better than they are, and there is as you pointed out tonnes of common sense ways to go about that,

newtboy said:

You misread. Please don't speak for me, especially when you're so wrong.

I support both disband the police, which means require all police to go through the hiring process again with those with multiple or serious complaints on their record disqualified or at least forced into retraining and a long probationary period...and I also support defund the police...meaning remove mental health from their job (and fund a mental health department that is sent on mental health calls, normally without police escort), it means the SWAT team is only called after weapons are used, not pre-emptive for non-violent calls, so can be cut in half or less. It means ZERO dollars for military equipment.
It does not mean eradicating the police, it does not mean cut ALL police funding, it means remove the second, third, and fourth hats they wear, remove violent or abusive officers, and cut their funding accordingly.

Mostly I think people want enforceable responsibility, criminal and civil, not immunity. If police had no shield from their actions, they would act better instantly. That's a no brainer and doesn't cost a dime.

Edit: eradicating the police unions would go a long way towards fixing the culture.

I think the demands of the public are more homogeneous than you claim....I know so, since you mischaracterized my position to create an outlier. That said, people do have different ideas of how to fix a problem we seem to agree on....but stripping immunity seems to be nearly universal outside police and Republican senator circles.

The people running the country aren't our best and brightest, they are those narcissistic enough to think they alone can make a difference and those slimy enough to think they can take advantage of an elected position for their personal gain. Trump proves undeniably that they aren't necessarily better educated , smart, or professional.

The Walk.

newtboy says...

No, it's not.

Part 1: It's exactly the same gradient in both videos...probably the same exact ramp.
This is not a wheelchair ramp, which is what your ada numbers represent. If you're going to mock the video, you should at least get your ramp type right.

Part2: Where's the comparison video of Trump slowly struggling to climb this ever so steep ramp? A 3' rise in nearly 40' is not steep unless you are severely disabled. (BTW, that's about a 4.3 degree ramp, a 7.3% slope....those stripes are about 1.5' wide, and the stage floor is only two stripes up from ground level. Again, if you're going to mock the video, at least get your numbers close if not right.).

Apples to apples then, 15:20- 15:30. https://youtu.be/wY5rduEmEwk
Joe jogs, Trump barely thinks he can.

Or feel free to compare Trump's "run" at the end (the only "running" we've ever seen from him) with this then ... https://youtu.be/BY5sB7GvabY


Part3: Yes, Trump already described this event, and his description/explanation was nearly identical to yours....just like @bcglorf said. I'd say his 100% is close, Trump may have used a different arrangement of words but he said exactly the same thing.

Your implications are apparently that you think Trump is healthy, as healthy as Biden, and the media is making his poor health up. That is demonstrably false by any metric. Biden is old as fuck and my second to last choice from the Democratic field (Clinton is my last choice), but hands down Biden beats Trump in vigor, cognition, stability....just about any measure of health, mental or physical, that I've ever heard of except possibly the ability to deceive.

BTW, sarcasm could totally be interpreted from your comment. You deride the numbers given then offer your own random numbers that are exponentially farther off, and give a nonsensical excuse that this isn't a proper wheelchair ramp, how could an able bodied man possibly walk up and down it!? Many people assume nonsense like that will be taken as a joke, so refuse to use the sarcasm button.
Again, if you want to deride other people's facts, you should get yours right...it's about a 4.3 degree ramp, not 11.

harlequinn said:

It's an 11 degree ramp, not 3, which is over 2 times the gradient allowed (as per the ADA). And the ADA requires ramps of this sort to have handrails.

Where's the comparison video? I.e., Biden coming down the ramp.


Part 1: the video portrays mocking. If they're going to mock someone, they should at least get their numbers right, otherwise they're no better than Trump and his continual exaggerations (e.g. it's like them saying "and it was the least steepest ramp in the world, and I've walked all the ramps of the world, more than anyone else").

Part 2: if they're trying to be funny by comparing two things then you have to, you know, compare the two things. So where is the video of Biden coming down the ramp? I want to see Biden cartwheel down the ramp like a champ.
Part 3: "I can 100% expect Trump, if he ever sees the clip, to respond exactly as your comment did", except for the fact that Trump already described this event (walking down the ramp) in this video. So you better check your 100%

BTW, there is no dilemma - no sarcasm was implied or could be interpreted from my comment, and there is a little sarcasm check box that remained unchecked (just to be sure). On the other hand, I fully expected someone to try to diminish my comment, because facts always get in the way of a good story.

"can't take back no hurt"

newtboy says...

People can misuse statistics to prove anything. Forfty percent of all people know that.

I'm afraid you're misrepresenting the statistics.
Those are based on overall US population, not racially divided populations.

30 per million blacks killed even though they are only 13% of the population vs 12 per million whites even though they are 76%. That's 30 dead blacks for every 12 dead whites.
Whites don't get off Scott free, but per capita it's close.
1/6 as many blacks as whites but 2.5 times more dead...making it 15 times more dead blacks per capita when divided by race...not over twice as many whites like you said.

The numbers aren't as lopsided as expected because you made a massive statistical error. Try again please.

All these issues you list are demonstrably used more often against non whites. This doesn't mean exclusively, but if your base stats are right, it should be 3-1 whites getting shafted if it wasn't racist, but it's more like 15-1 blacks/browns being shafted.

scheherazade said:

I looked up some stats just to see.
^

2020 Jeep Wrangler Rolls Over In Small Overlap Crash Tests

wtfcaniuse says...

You might want to watch all those videos again.

Hitting a parked car at 60km/h and not rolling would be a clearly better outcome. The parked car is not a solid wall, it cannot bring you to a "dead stop".

Hitting a barrier and rolling is clearly worse than hitting the same barrier and sliding along it, "bouncing" off it, spinning etc even if you're clipped by another car. Again even with the sharp swerve into the barrier it would never have been a "dead stop"

Hitting the car in front which has suddenly braked would be far better than a high speed roll even if the car behind proceeds to rear end you. The closest to your "dead stop" scenario and still far better than a high speed roll.

I'm arguing with you because you often backup what you're saying with demonstrable facts, in this case you're not. You're ignoring variables, using differing experience to draw conclusions and dismissing the severity of something based on your controlled personal experience of it.

"Citation? Physics. acceleration = Δv/Δt. Larger injuries come from higher g forces."

Has nothing to do with studies in vehicular CSI. I asked for a citation relating to maximum force/time being a primary factor in vehicular CSI not a physics equation and a stunningly simplified opinion. Again this is the shit I'm arguing with you about.

Norway landslide sweeps homes into sea

newtboy says...

No doubt. It appears to be going back to it's original site at the end.

Side note, now that you've demonstrated your abilities, Gaia, can you please push another white house into the sea for me?

BSR said:

Was that one white house built on a raft! Totally refused to succumb.

Florsheim - One Of The Most Expensive Restorations

oblio70 says...

He’s kinda like the Mr. Rogers of tradeworkers. I found myself blissed out and open minded just listening this demonstration of something I’d never thought about before.

Police fire (paintball?) at residents on their front porch

vil says...

What is the objective here? Is there some danger in the street that people will be protected from if they go inside the house? Are they allowed to look out of windows? Should they turn their lights off and lie on the floor? Or is this just a testosterone driven demonstration of police (state) stupidity? Police creating more police haters. Good job! MAGA!

Unfit

wtfcaniuse says...

Hahahaha demonstrably false. You're either lying intentionally or completely delusional.

He has NEVER had an approval rating above 50%. He is the only POTUS since that sort of polling was done to NEVER have majority support for his actions. Do you understand how terrible that is?

He didn't even get the majority of the peoples vote ffs.

The FACT that a REPUBLICAN group is putting out these ads should give you some insight into his epic levels of ineptitude but as I said before, you're lying or delusional so facts and reality don't enter into it.

@newtboy You don't even need intelligent leadership as shown by Australia

bobknight33 said:

The best POTUS in last 60 years.

MEGA 2020

Diversity and inclusion meeting ... at Michigan school

bremnet says...

Sorry, you lost me at "greatest country in the world", or at the very least your list of "despite it being..." is way, way too short. Greatest at or greatest for what? Bigots per capita? Most frequent demonstrations of unsubstantiated entitlement and negative IQ's?

newtboy said:

It is the greatest country in the world DESPITE it being the home of some of the most disrespectful racist assholes in the world like edit:Thomas E Burtell of Saline Michigan. Sadly, that status is in serious jeopardy because of them. Edit: Fortunately even his own son is disgusted by him and disavowed and condemned his racist and bigoted comments. He identified himself, so I have no qualms about identifying him, but I won't post his address and phone number like others have.

I hope the incessant abuse and ostracism he receives from the community as a whole from this day forward force him to leave not just that school system but this great country...MAGA by getting the fuck out, douchebag.

http://click2nextorder.com/fit-body-keto/ (Health Talk Post)

newtboy says...

Classic....sounds like a meth rant.

"The point that misses the mark regarding quality, is the voices on the stroll through recordings. This specific voices are extremely the individuals they sound mechanical while much in the event that they are perusing from being a content. So when you want great outcomes with these recordings you will need to record specific voice overs. Furthermore, true to form they do give you the transcripts pores and skin recordings and demonstrate you to make the voice overs."

*ban

Demonstrating Quantum Supremacy

moonsammy says...

It'll be useful eventually, but I wouldn't bank on soon. My final project in college was related to quantum computing, which at the time (18 years ago) was effectively entirely theoretical. I've enjoyed seeing the steady, albeit slow, progress.

The areas where quantum computing will really shine are problems which involve a huge number of possible answers, but only one best or correct one. The traveling salesman problem is a classic of computer science, as you can scale it up in complexity to the point where any traditional computer will eventually choke on the sheer number of permutations to test. Great way to demonstrate the need for clever solutions and well-written algorithms vs brute force approaches. An adequately sophisticated quantum computer, however, will theoretically be able to solve the traveling salesman problem nearly instantly, regardless of the level of complexity / number of nodes to navigate. Because it just tests all possible answers simultaneously.

vil said:

Much like nuclear fusion. Apparently it works but is it useful yet? Ever?

Mordhaus (Member Profile)

School coach Keanon Lowe disarms student

viewer_999 says...

Without hostility, I gotta be honest here: I don't really know what you're trying to say. My best guess is, "Treating him with compassion is good for [me]." In this case, at least, I disagree. If I were immortal and/or striving for sainthood, perhaps. But I have one life with limited time, as do those I love and seek to protect. Those who are in search of said sainthood may care for this person all they wish; and may they do it away from society and the rest of us who choose life.

It is foolish to issue probation to someone who brought a loaded gun to class. They've already demonstrated intent to harm and thus should have the option/means to do so again removed.

BSR said:

Funny thing about compassion. What you think is meant for others is REALLY meant for you.

What if We Nuke a City?

vil says...

Lets get all countries to organize their institutions in such a way that idealistic moral imperatives and vows are binding. No cheating, not even lying. Ever. Yes you too, Saddam. And Vladimir. And Pooh too. I mean Xi Jinping. I am sure if we ask them all nicely or sign a petition or demonstrate in front of the Indian and Pakistani embassies 24/7 surely they will come around.

If we disarm now, how do we divert that asteroid when we need to?

bobknight33 (Member Profile)

newtboy says...

No Biden corruption...only Trump collusion.

There was no prosecution or investigation at the time Joe Biden, with full American, international, and Ukrainian backing, pushed to have them remove a corrupt prosecutor who refused to prosecute corruption. The investigation of the company his son had worked for was closed, finding zero wrongdoing, long before Joe pushed them to remove an internationally recognized corrupt prosecutor. Every part of the story Trump told you, besides the location, is demonstrably, obviously, factually wrong. It's a pure Trump lie.
Most of the republicans repeating his lies know that for a fact, having been witness to what actually happened, the rest are willfully ignorant, refusing to look into it because they KNOW Trump is lying to them but don't want to admit it to themselves or you.

Trump's administration is by far the most corrupt in modern history, with more convictions, more forced out of office for malfeasance, more dishonesty and outright lies to the press, the American people, congress, the supreme court, international leaders, etc. There's no one they haven't lied to, and they go on tv and say they're justified lying to everyone, they have no obligation to tell the truth unless they're under oath, but even then they lie constantly....and get caught because they're stupid and dumb.

Really?! What evidence can you point to that isn't Trump's flapping gums? None. This conspiracy theory was also investigated and found to be as truthful as the pizza pedophile ring Clinton led from a pizza place's basement that didn't exist.

That's exactly what Trump says, the president can't be prosecuted or investigated, and anyone who does investigate him is a traitor who should face a firing squad, not Democrats or independents.
That's why more than 1/2 of registered voters think we know enough already to remove him, and 20-30% more think he should be removed if the charges are true, and the white house admitted they are true and offered written proof themselves, so dumb they thought it would exonerate him. *facepalm.
We're saying if you are so demented you make up insane self serving stories in your head like Biden stopped a prosecution, then you act as if they're factual, you should be removed from office for dementia, as should anyone who repeats your lies.

Now, if we're worried an administration may have abused their power to enrich their family, we should look at the king of nepotism, the Trumps, who do private business with countries we aren't aligned with and OBVIOUSLY, UNAMBIGUOUSLY get special favors and do nothing jobs that pay millions....Ivanka's trademarks in China for instance, bought with state promises by the president.

If Obama had had his personal attorneys skip around the globe pressuring foreign leaders to hurt his political opponents, withholding approved aid until they agree to help him personally, you would have lost your shit so thoroughly you could replace your home toilet with a urinal. There's zero question Trump has done this, he and Giuliani both have admitted it and there's evidence that, for once, they're telling the truth, too dumb to know collusion is wrong, too dumb to know admitting to extortion makes them suspects.

bobknight33 said:

Not relevant. Trump is finding out Biden's corruption in Ukraine Trump did run on cleaning the swamp.


Also Ukraine help DNC gather dirt on Trump for 2016 election.


So you saying if I rob a bank and then run for POTUS you can't investigate?



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