Sorry it's taken this long to respond...

Your points are well made. Looking back, my point at the time was a reaction to what I perceived as more needless criticism of religion in general via its fringe elements.

Skepticism is important for both theists and atheists. As science advances, religious belief becomes more refined. If it rains during a picnic, few believe it's because "the gods" were angry. As a skeptic, this refinement is of little use to you, yet skepticism keeps the sincere religious on their toes.

I don't recall any major politician invoking God's will for any particular reason. I agree that they let people reach their own conclusions, e.g. Bush is devout, and by invading Iraq "while devout" this is "proof" that God wanted the USA to invade Iraq.

My answer to the whole kerfuffle is the saying attributed to Abe Lincoln, about being able to fool some of the people all of the time.

We're all annoyed by those we perceive as getting a free pass. As a believer that the earth's climate is what it's always been and no danger to humans, I'm angry Algore gets away with bad, distorted science with no rebuttals from anyone.

Reason is a godsend (ha!) but it's always in short supply. Man is still a vicious animal whose impulses must be controlled. In the past, religion filled that need. Today it still does, but coupled with complex laws and greater understanding of the natural world. The Mystery continues to expand along with our leaps in knowledge.

In reply to this comment by BicycleRepairMan:
Yes I do see a problem with that, I dont blame John McCain for the crusades and I dont blame Cat Stevens for 9/11, but that was not my point, I merely pointed out to you that being an atheist towards the christian god doesnt guarantee a reasonable viewpoint on any other subject. The problem with the "atheist communists" was not that they were too fond of skeptical and critical thinking....

Good points all. I'll write more soon.

In reply to this comment by BicycleRepairMan:
Yes I do see a problem with that, I dont blame John McCain for the crusades and I dont blame Cat Stevens for 9/11, but that was not my point, I merely pointed out to you that being an atheist towards the christian god doesnt guarantee a reasonable viewpoint on any other subject. The problem with the "atheist communists" was not that they were too fond of skeptical and critical thinking, these regimes were not beacons of reasonableness, infact they were just the opposite, any critical voice was quelled and expelled or imprisoned or killed.

I am an atheist because I am skeptical by nature, and I want the same skepticism to apply to all ideas, whether its Islam, Christianity, communism or any ideas that I agree with. My biggest problem with religious "faith" is that people who profess it are getting away with outright idiotic statements and actions, simply because its faith. when McCain or Bush or some politician exclaims that "God talks to them" it is to me as absurd as saying that the tooth fairy is to blame for the high oil prices. Yet they get away with it as if it was a completely normal thing to say for a grown man.

They should be met with contempt and ridicule for such statements, not because of the crusades or 9/11, but simply because the statements themselves are ridiculous. There is enough bullshit as it is, and if we dont add an equal opportunity bullshit filter, bullshit is gonna sift through the holes, and we are raising the next generations of people lying to themselves and eachother. Right now there is a 6-lane highway tunnel through the bullshit filter, and that hole is called faith, where ridiculous ideas can march freely without questions, and when we allow that tunnel to be there, anything goes. That means you can have the means and knowhow it takes to design a nuclear bomb, and still believe you get the 72 virgins in paradise, because whatever else youve learned about the world, you've been taught from you were born not to question certain types of claims.

In reply to this comment by quantumushroom:
I understand what you're saying. Do you see anything wrong with lumping all religious peoples with fanatics and rapture nuts?


In reply to this comment by BicycleRepairMan:
Dont forget the atheist crusaders that killed thousands of true muslims, or the hundreds of unbaptised, un-christian suicide bomber atheists that kills true believers in iraq every day. Goddamn atheist scum!

In reply to this comment by quantumushroom:
No, Henning. Atheistic communists alone are responsible for 100 million murdered worldwide.

First time I got banned really sucked because I had over 100 clips on there, the one that killed the account was the Stephen Colbert Press Correspondents dinner, it was my fault the damn thing went viral, back in those days you had to find the torrents download, clip into segments, then re-upload. Somebody wasn't happy that clip got on the internet....Of Course, its back on youtube now.

2nd Time I got banned was for uploading Cat Stevens "Peace Train"

I guess I've only been banned twice, I'm on my third account.

My favourite musicians feature on Extras. Cat Stevens and Kate Bush. Guess Ricky is about our age.

I'm going somewhat against the tide here as well. The presentation was very prejudiced. To suggest Iraq is a Christian war is ridiculous. In the past, Christianity has been the justification for horrible things. However, the great majority of these atrocities were political or fascist in nature, not intrinsic to the religion. The corrupt hid behind the Cross, just as criminals hide behind Allah. There are many good Christians and many good Muslims in the world. There are also bad apples in both camps. (In my community lives one of the great, so called "Christian," fruitcakes of all time, so I should know.)
However, the US is not a theocracy. Our foreign and domestic policy is not controlled by the church, and let's all PRAY, (to whomever you choose), it never becomes so. Theocracies are dangerous and represent the greatest threat to personal freedom imaginable.
Is it a good idea to be trying to convert Muslims in combat zones? No, it isn't. But, even as looney as some evangelical Christians can be, they generally profess, (and believe), they want to "save" people, not kill them. As the man, formerly known as Cat Stevens, said about the fatwa on Salman Rushdie, paraphrased, "it's easy to see how this could happen, because the Koran is quite clear on this matter....he who defames the prophet must die." Radical Muslims are much more dangerous than radical Christians because of this distinction between us and the "infidels." During the Barbary Coast piracy crisis, George Washington wanted to know why Muslim pirates thought they could seize sovereign ships;
In 1786 Jefferson and John Adams went to negotiate with Tripoli's envoy to London, Ambassador Sidi Haji Abdrahaman or (Sidi Haji Abdul Rahman Adja). They asked him by what right he extorted money and took slaves. Jefferson reported to Secretary of State John Jay, and to the Congress:

The ambassador answered us that [the right] was founded on the Laws of the Prophet (Mohammed), that it was written in their Koran, that all nations who should not have answered their authority were sinners, that it was their right and duty to make war upon them wherever they could be found, and to make slaves of all they could take as prisoners, and that every Mussulman (or Muslim) who should be slain in battle was sure to go to heaven. [2]

This battle between free-peoples and theocracy has been going on for a long time. Unfortunately, it probably has a long way to go.

Its called Tea For the Tillerman and its by Cat Stevens from the album also called "Tea For the Tillerman"

In reply to this comment by ARTAX1:
WHATS THE NAME OF THE SONG IN THIS EPSIDOE IN THE ENDING CREDITS? IS IT DAVID BOWIE?

He has a very Cat Stevens/Usef lilt to his voice. Just watched them perform this on David Letterman, lovely.

As you can see the Owner of this group has been disabled from using youtube

some "third party" didn't appreciate me uploading a Cat Stevens video.

upvote for the extremely relevant Cat Stevens. think about it. "Peace Train" by Cat Stevens.

Ok, I think I could be Raven's dad . . . here goes:

Desert Island Stuff (not in order):

Jethro Tull - Thick as a Brick & A Passion Play and the rest
Peter Gabriel - everything
Beethoven's Symphonies
Phil Keaggy - Beyond Nature
Stevie Wonder - Songs in the Key of Life
King Crimson - everything
Mel Torme - anything
Cat Stevens - most all of it
The Who - Quadrophenia
Pink Floyd - Early years before DSOM
Van Morrison - Avalon Sunset
Beatles

BicycleRepairMan, you're funny man. I mean if we follow your line of thinking we should just eliminate Christmas now altogether now shouldn't we? Oh Easter too... I mean it's a indoctrinated religious holiday. Thinking that kids are so easily indoctrinated is funny, I think Islamic parents have too much to worry on their hands to sit and brainwash their kids with Cat Stevens records. Also Gospel music... that is religious no?

What you want to celebrate is your choice, I celebrate Christmas because I like to spend a few days of with my family and eat good food (So shoot the hypocrit down) I never have, nor ever will force anyone to listen to gospel, either related to christmas or otherwise. Easter is also just a few days off for me, nothing more..

I dont deny the reality that religion exist, and I believe it exists much for the same reasons science exists: We Want Answers, Damnit!

Religion, however simply "gives you the truth" and asks you to believe it no matter what, while Science looks for the truth. People will keep finding gaps in science to put their gods, but nowadays, for anyone familiar with the concepts of evolution by natural selection, those gaps sure are tiny, and the inclusion of a god raises a whole lot more questions than it answers.

I respect, in no uncertain terms, other peoples right to have any religion or belief they want.

BicycleRepairMan, you're funny man. I mean if we follow your line of thinking we should just eliminate Christmas now altogether now shouldn't we? Oh Easter too... I mean it's a indoctrinated religious holiday. Thinking that kids are so easily indoctrinated is funny, I think Islamic parents have too much to worry on their hands to sit and brainwash their kids with Cat Stevens records. Also Gospel music... that is religious no?

I been exposed to all the religions of the world and in no way can I take the absolutist view that all religion is flawed in someway, rather it's the basis upon which scientific discovery took place, because it couldn't provide answers for mans questions in the world. Religion has been and will be for the foreseeable future a major part of what it means to be a human being. For even within the NASA space program, their first orbit around the moon, do you know what they picked to read?

The religions you rail against have passed from time to time to us, the people who preached from them changed. But the basic message never does.


BTW If you ever wish to work outside the Western World it's best to have a tolerable understanding of other religions.

this is an alphabet song for kids. please take your personal fights and prejudices else where gorillaman

No, it is religious indoctrination disguised as education. Religious delusions poisons everything, Cat Stevens is one sad example.

Harold and Maude is a movie directed by Hal Ashby in 1971. The film, featuring light humor, dark humor, and existentialist drama, centers around the exploits of a morbid young man -- Harold -- who drifts away from the life that his detached mother prescribes him as he falls in love with septuagenarian Maude.

The film is number 45 on the American Film Institute's list of 100 Funniest Movies of all time[1], number 42 on Bravo's 100 Funniest Movies and on IMDB's list of the best 250 movies ever made. In 1997, it was selected for preservation in the National Film Registry of the Library of Congress [2]. It is particularly noteworthy as having an enormous and zealous cult following.

The film was a commercial failure when it was released although the critical reception was extremely positive. The screenplay upon which the film was based was written by Colin Higgins, and published as a novel[3] in 1971. The movie was shot in the San Francisco Bay Area. Harold and Maude was also a play on Broadway for some time.

The movie has given rise to two new words: "Harolding" (hanging around cemeteries) described by Douglas Coupland in "Harolding in West Vancouver" (1996); and "Maudism" or "Maudianism", the philosophy of living each day to the fullest.[4]. This may also have a link to the phonetically-identical philosophy of Modism.

The entire soundtrack for the movie is by Cat Stevens.

Yeah! F*ck Canada! What are they gonna do? Ask us for an apology? Its fun to be dicks!



... by the way, anyone hear how Sen. Ted Steven's wife Catherine gets pulled aside and questioned everytime she tries to fly? ('Cat' Stevens, hah!) I heard him say this on CSPAN and thought it was hilarious.