Propaganda piece for Jacque Fresco's Venus Project. Peter Joseph does a good job at recognizing problems but a lousy job at offering solutions. The Zeitgeist movement is about sacrificing individual sovereignty for the sake of a one-world vision. Joseph assumes everyone will abandon their own self-interest in the name of some global interest.

I have 2 problems with the Zeitgeist movement: 1) Morally, altruism is incompatible with freedom and individual rights. Man is not some sacrificial animal here to serve the collective group. 2) It's completely unrealistic. Everyone is always motivated by their own self interest. It's part of our DNA. Changing that is impossible.

Now what I'm really curious about is if Joseph really believes this bunk or if he's serving a greater agenda. Wonder who funded this most recent film. From a cinematic standpoint, it's pretty good.

He's brilliant, and it's a shame that his vision will probably never be embraced by civilization at large.

I made a visit to the Venus Project and met him a few months ago, and he's a wonderful man. When you're in his presence you'd never guess that he was 92. He's so full of energy and enthusiasm.

In reply to this comment by Irishman:
Man, I was going to send you a link to the Venus Project in my last reply! I have seen no better vision for a harmonious civilisation that this, removing the monetary system wipes out so many problems. The need to make a profit is driving the entire planet to destruction. When I started reading Jacques Fresco's stuff, it was like somebody just switched the lights on.

It opened my eyes to the stuff we're being fed via the news about resources running out, food running out blah blah blah - there are enough resources, enough skill and enough talent to make this vision work right now, it is the rich and powerful who stand in the way.

In reply to this comment by HollywoodBob:
There's a gentleman here in Florida that I've grown to thoroughly admire. He's a futurist by the name Jacques Fresco and he's designed a future free of much of the bullshit that we deal with today, a global community with a cybernated resource based society. In his world money doesn't exist, the government is run by computer constructs administered by the best and brightest(not the power hungry), and industry has been automated to allow people the freedom to work on the betterment of mankind. You might enjoy checking him out. www.thevenusproject.com

In reply to this comment by Irishman:
You assume correctly Bob - born, bred, still living and working in Ireland

I was having this exact discussion with a friend tonight, he is of the opinion that as soon as you kill one single person you are just as bad as the oppressor. There's no arguing against that of course - you *are* just as bad. But it's a reaction against oppression that with hindsight is seen to be inevitable, all the way back through historical conflict.

Government by its very nature can never have a utopian worldview. All forms of hierarchical control will not achieve this, whether they be democracy, socialism or communism. They are all different flavours of the monkey-brain male dominator culture.

That leaves us with anarchy, which to me means every individual pursuing their own desires with no outside control, restraint or boundary. This is in fact how we lived for many hundreds of thousands of years, this is our paradise lost, our ancient utopia that can be unearthed and discovered through many ancient and sacred texts...



In reply to this comment by HollywoodBob:
I'll agree with you that oppression leads to revolution, and Kennedy's quote fits the situation in Ireland quite well. The British refused to deal with Irish independence diplomatically and fairly, so they brought the ensuing violence upon themselves. Oppression isn't a necessity of life though. Nations can get along just fine without needing to oppress/occupy other nations.

I'm assuming you're country would be Ireland? It's terrible what the British government did there. It was needless, and really just a complete waste of life.

I keep hoping the leaders of this world will grow up and get a more utopian world view. If nations did more to better the world as a whole than just protecting their own interests the world would be a much better place.

In reply to this comment by Irishman:
That's exactly how I used to think, until I started studying the history of my own country.

Oppression leads to revolution, always has done and always will. The monster is he who does nothing...

In reply to this comment by HollywoodBob:
I would say that if you kill innocent people, regardless of your motives, you are a monster.

Those who make peaceful revolution impossible, make violent revolution inevitable. - John F. Kennedy

He's right in that if peace doesn't work, violence is your next course of action. But he's wrong on the necessity of revolution.

In reply to this comment by Irishman:
Fighting against oppression with violence is not becoming Nietzsche's monster at all. Fighting oppression will always be as violent as it needs to be.

When peaceful revolution is impossible, violent revolution is inevitable. I forget who said that...

In reply to this comment by HollywoodBob:
In reply to this comment by Irishman:
And yeah, people need to get themselves over Nietzsche and start thinking for themselves again.

I'm not a big fan of Nietzsche, I just like that quote and it fits the point I was trying to make.

Man, I was going to send you a link to the Venus Project in my last reply! I have seen no better vision for a harmonious civilisation that this, removing the monetary system wipes out so many problems. The need to make a profit is driving the entire planet to destruction. When I started reading Jacques Fresco's stuff, it was like somebody just switched the lights on.

It opened my eyes to the stuff we're being fed via the news about resources running out, food running out blah blah blah - there are enough resources, enough skill and enough talent to make this vision work right now, it is the rich and powerful who stand in the way.

In reply to this comment by HollywoodBob:
There's a gentleman here in Florida that I've grown to thoroughly admire. He's a futurist by the name Jacques Fresco and he's designed a future free of much of the bullshit that we deal with today, a global community with a cybernated resource based society. In his world money doesn't exist, the government is run by computer constructs administered by the best and brightest(not the power hungry), and industry has been automated to allow people the freedom to work on the betterment of mankind. You might enjoy checking him out. www.thevenusproject.com

In reply to this comment by Irishman:
You assume correctly Bob - born, bred, still living and working in Ireland

I was having this exact discussion with a friend tonight, he is of the opinion that as soon as you kill one single person you are just as bad as the oppressor. There's no arguing against that of course - you *are* just as bad. But it's a reaction against oppression that with hindsight is seen to be inevitable, all the way back through historical conflict.

Government by its very nature can never have a utopian worldview. All forms of hierarchical control will not achieve this, whether they be democracy, socialism or communism. They are all different flavours of the monkey-brain male dominator culture.

That leaves us with anarchy, which to me means every individual pursuing their own desires with no outside control, restraint or boundary. This is in fact how we lived for many hundreds of thousands of years, this is our paradise lost, our ancient utopia that can be unearthed and discovered through many ancient and sacred texts...



In reply to this comment by HollywoodBob:
I'll agree with you that oppression leads to revolution, and Kennedy's quote fits the situation in Ireland quite well. The British refused to deal with Irish independence diplomatically and fairly, so they brought the ensuing violence upon themselves. Oppression isn't a necessity of life though. Nations can get along just fine without needing to oppress/occupy other nations.

I'm assuming you're country would be Ireland? It's terrible what the British government did there. It was needless, and really just a complete waste of life.

I keep hoping the leaders of this world will grow up and get a more utopian world view. If nations did more to better the world as a whole than just protecting their own interests the world would be a much better place.

In reply to this comment by Irishman:
That's exactly how I used to think, until I started studying the history of my own country.

Oppression leads to revolution, always has done and always will. The monster is he who does nothing...

In reply to this comment by HollywoodBob:
I would say that if you kill innocent people, regardless of your motives, you are a monster.

Those who make peaceful revolution impossible, make violent revolution inevitable. - John F. Kennedy

He's right in that if peace doesn't work, violence is your next course of action. But he's wrong on the necessity of revolution.

In reply to this comment by Irishman:
Fighting against oppression with violence is not becoming Nietzsche's monster at all. Fighting oppression will always be as violent as it needs to be.

When peaceful revolution is impossible, violent revolution is inevitable. I forget who said that...

In reply to this comment by HollywoodBob:
In reply to this comment by Irishman:
And yeah, people need to get themselves over Nietzsche and start thinking for themselves again.

I'm not a big fan of Nietzsche, I just like that quote and it fits the point I was trying to make.

after having seen the original zeitgeist, this was disappointing.

once it began turning into a propaganda video for "the venus project," it became painful to watch....

and for the record, TECHNOLOGY *is not* the answer!

0:00-40:00: really good/must see. this is a great description of our monetary system.
40:00-43:30 completely false
46:00-49:00 completely false
49:00+ going downhill real quick
60:00+ getting into ridiculous nonsense at this point
65:00+ are you serious, I thought you just said business was bad 5 minutes ago?
69:00+ efficiency and abundance are the enemies of profit? so if you are mining gold bars, and figured out a process to extract 10 gold bars instead of only 1, you are unhappy because then the prices of gold goes down? wtf are you talking about?
71:00+ eliminating the need for prisons? are you crazy?
73:00+ a world of flying boomerang airplanes, what the hell is this? I need to donate to whatever the opposition of the venus project is, christ.
74:20+ a world with super robots producing food and labor so no humans have to work? thats your ace in the hole solution to everything? hello, didn't we see how that ended in the terminator and the matrix?
79:30+ false, all of those mediums require massive resources to construct
82:00+ good idea, lets replace airplanes with trains. would be a fun trip from Argentina to Australia on a train. By the way, all the technology you have been talking about was developed through corporate greed under the evil monetary system, how do you explain that one?
85:00+ robot doctors? really? so you are going to be okay with a robot grabbing your balls and telling you to turn your head and cough?
86:00+ no legal system at all because crimes are caused by money? so rape and murder--thats just due to bounced checks? pendulums in cars to correct for drunk driving? this is getting really hard to watch...

sorry I'm losing it...the venus project is just insane.

That Venus Project looks great - but I'm always suspicous of these things. If you look at Le Corbusier's drawings they also look amazing - but in reality, the social housing his ideas and designs inspired in Britain, and the rest of the world, are dire!