>> ^Drachen_Jager:

Tell me the timecode where he provides the brilliant argument that makes your point then. I don't have time to waste on stupid Christian videos that seem to be only tangentially related to the argument at hand and don't even appear to support your side.
>> ^Toshley:
>> ^Drachen_Jager:
Umm, he says repeatedly in the video that morality is subjective. I got as far as the point where he said he wasn't going to talk about using the bible as on objective standard. The rest just seems to be excusing all the wicked behaviour in the Old Testament on a variety of thin pretexts. I'm not going to waste my time with the whole thing. He certainly seems to be backing my side of this argument.
See this page for moral problems in the New Testament. Obviously even the new/old testament argument doesn't really hold much water. Humans make their own morality, 2,000 year old books are out of date and any idiot who thinks a modern person can safely determine moral issues using no human judgement, only the Bible as a source is utterly hopeless.
>> ^Toshley:
At this point, I am going to go ahead and assume you're a troll.
If you're honestly confused, I suggest you watch:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1PrZeqhsdqE


There's no point in continuing this conversation.
I am looking for intellectual and rational discussion here. You've admitted that you didn't watch the entire video and then expect me to follow some link you provided?
Feel free to continue calling me an idiot, I personally don't care.



You don't have time to waste on a stupid Christian video but yet you had time to watch this one, comment on it, and defend your lack of belief militantly.

Congratulations on time management.

Please stop replying to my messages unless you want to talk in a civil manner. The video was directly related to the discussion at hand, you would have known that if you had watched the entire video.

Of course it "Do not even appear" to support my side because the video touches on multiple subjects.

Troll somewhere else. I am done.

Tell me the timecode where he provides the brilliant argument that makes your point then. I don't have time to waste on stupid Christian videos that seem to be only tangentially related to the argument at hand and don't even appear to support your side.

>> ^Toshley:

>> ^Drachen_Jager:
Umm, he says repeatedly in the video that morality is subjective. I got as far as the point where he said he wasn't going to talk about using the bible as on objective standard. The rest just seems to be excusing all the wicked behaviour in the Old Testament on a variety of thin pretexts. I'm not going to waste my time with the whole thing. He certainly seems to be backing my side of this argument.
See this page for moral problems in the New Testament. Obviously even the new/old testament argument doesn't really hold much water. Humans make their own morality, 2,000 year old books are out of date and any idiot who thinks a modern person can safely determine moral issues using no human judgement, only the Bible as a source is utterly hopeless.
>> ^Toshley:
At this point, I am going to go ahead and assume you're a troll.
If you're honestly confused, I suggest you watch:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1PrZeqhsdqE


There's no point in continuing this conversation.
I am looking for intellectual and rational discussion here. You've admitted that you didn't watch the entire video and then expect me to follow some link you provided?
Feel free to continue calling me an idiot, I personally don't care.

>> ^Drachen_Jager:

Umm, he says repeatedly in the video that morality is subjective. I got as far as the point where he said he wasn't going to talk about using the bible as on objective standard. The rest just seems to be excusing all the wicked behaviour in the Old Testament on a variety of thin pretexts. I'm not going to waste my time with the whole thing. He certainly seems to be backing my side of this argument.
See this page for moral problems in the New Testament. Obviously even the new/old testament argument doesn't really hold much water. Humans make their own morality, 2,000 year old books are out of date and any idiot who thinks a modern person can safely determine moral issues using no human judgement, only the Bible as a source is utterly hopeless.
>> ^Toshley:
At this point, I am going to go ahead and assume you're a troll.
If you're honestly confused, I suggest you watch:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1PrZeqhsdqE



There's no point in continuing this conversation.

I am looking for intellectual and rational discussion here. You've admitted that you didn't watch the entire video and then expect me to follow some link you provided?

Feel free to continue calling me an idiot, I personally don't care.

Umm, he says repeatedly in the video that morality is subjective. I got as far as the point where he said he wasn't going to talk about using the bible as on objective standard. The rest just seems to be excusing all the wicked behaviour in the Old Testament on a variety of thin pretexts. I'm not going to waste my time with the whole thing. He certainly seems to be backing my side of this argument.

See this page for moral problems in the New Testament. Obviously even the new/old testament argument doesn't really hold much water. Humans make their own morality, 2,000 year old books are out of date and any idiot who thinks a modern person can safely determine moral issues using no human judgement, only the Bible as a source is utterly hopeless.

>> ^Toshley:
At this point, I am going to go ahead and assume you're a troll.
If you're honestly confused, I suggest you watch:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1PrZeqhsdqE

Congratulations! Your video, Debunking Steve Harvey's Anti-atheist comments, has reached the #1 spot in the current Top 15 New Videos listing. This is a very difficult thing to accomplish but you managed to pull it off. For your contribution you have been awarded 2 Power Points.

This achievement has earned you your "Golden One" Level 17 Badge!

>> ^Drachen_Jager:

So you get to choose between new and old testaments? If humans have a choice in their morality then it is people, not God who decide upon correct moral behaviour.
Thank you for supporting my argument.
>> ^Mcboinkens:
The Old Testament. He was telling his people how to live by his law. Then the new testament came and that rule is no longer a standard. That should help clear some things up.



At this point, I am going to go ahead and assume you're a troll.

If you're honestly confused, I suggest you watch:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1PrZeqhsdqE

So you get to choose between new and old testaments? If humans have a choice in their morality then it is people, not God who decide upon correct moral behaviour.

Thank you for supporting my argument.

>> ^Mcboinkens:
The Old Testament. He was telling his people how to live by his law. Then the new testament came and that rule is no longer a standard. That should help clear some things up.

[redacted]

So, you're using human reasoning to decide the correct moral path.

What part of that comes from the bible then? If you use reasoning to decide your morality, then your morality comes from man.

>> ^Toshley:

>> ^Drachen_Jager:
If all of your morality comes from the bible, why aren't you out stoning the cashiers who work at Wal-Mart on Sundays? That's what the bible tells you to do after all.
If you question it, or make up your own mind then your morality doesn't really come from the bible at all does it?

You're misinformed about the Bible. If you're going to criticize a religion, it might be best to read the literature, in this case... know the reasoning for the Old and New Testament.

"The LORD then gave these further instructions to Moses: 'Tell the people of Israel to keep my Sabbath day, for the Sabbath is a sign of the covenant between me and you forever. It helps you to remember that I am the LORD, who makes you holy. Yes, keep the Sabbath day, for it is holy. Anyone who desecrates it must die; anyone who works on that day will be cut off from the community. Work six days only, but the seventh day must be a day of total rest." (Exodus 31:12-15 NLT)

I can't find the spot where it says they should be stoned to death at the moment. Is killing them enough to satisfy you?

>> ^Mcboinkens:

>> ^Drachen_Jager:
If all of your morality comes from the bible, why aren't you out stoning the cashiers who work at Wal-Mart on Sundays? That's what the bible tells you to do after all.
If you question it, or make up your own mind then your morality doesn't really come from the bible at all does it?

As Toshley said, that is a pretty poor attempt. I don't have the Bible memorized to know what quote or implied idea you are talking about, but I'm pretty sure cashiers were never intended to be stoned. Not to mention the complete difference in the old and new testaments.
I do, however, disagree with morality comes from God. Here are the two possibilities that seem plausible to me: Morality was an evolutionary occurrence, as in creatures and animals had to make decisions that would further them among a species. Naturally as animal societies grow more complex so do choices, and as such you often have a "moral" and "immoral" choice to make. The second one is that morality was a result of sin entering the world. Naturally, if sin had not entered the world all would be perfect, and as such no choices would need to be made because it would be the only instinctive choice. However, when sin corrupted the world it opened up the ability to make "immoral" choices.

In fact, I'm really interested to hear why you think the Bible "tells us" to stone Wal-Mart cashiers.

>> ^BoneRemake:

" Weed heads " I wanna smack people who use terminology like that.
quality


I hear ya, the same with idiots. Unless it's Steve Harvey or Bill O'Realy?.

No really I was hoping that the resultant at the end would have shutdown Steve Harveys remaining brain functions; it looked so close. But, of course I erred as he has nothing to speak of. He's running of an old neck injury that accidentally re-introduced neurons into the system.

BTW, @Fusionaut I agree with what your saying. It makes me nearly want to punch Republicans when they don't realize where we get our LEGAL drugs (hint: we almost always go to war there or install some shit regime, etc...).

>> ^MaxWilder:

@<a rel="nofollow" href="http://videosift.com/member/Toshley" title="member since February 6th, 2011" class="profilelink">Toshley - Please explain Exodus 31:12-15. Although Jesus made a few exceptions for reasons of "compassion" in Matthew 12:1-14, but I don't see how that is a total rejection of the law.
I would advise you not to assume that atheists do not know the literature. Most of us in the US were raised Christian and became atheists because we learned too much about Christianity, and had the capacity for critical thought, which is anathema to religion.
If you feel that the Bible contradicts or invalidates a statement made by an atheist, please state the quote rather than telling somebody that they don't know the literature. Otherwise you will likely find that it is you that don't know it.


I don't even know where to begin with this.

I never said that atheists don't know the literature and I honestly don't appreciate you trying to turn what I said into a attack on the atheist community.

Let me break it down for you so you can understand it better:
"You're misinformed about the Bible. If you're going to criticize a religion, it might be best to read the literature, in this case... know the reasoning for the Old and New Testament."

Notice that I used "You're" at the beginning of the sentence, meaning you are. You, being a single person. Notice again that I began my next sentence the same way, clearly stating it was directed at the author of the comment, I was kind enough to quote so people didn't take it out of context (oddly wasn't enough).

I don't feel the need to respond to the rest of your message because you seem like the type of person to just twist what I say and try and use it against me.

If you want to be civil and talk with an open-mind, you're more than welcome to talk with me.

[redacted]

>> ^Drachen_Jager:

If all of your morality comes from the bible, why aren't you out stoning the cashiers who work at Wal-Mart on Sundays? That's what the bible tells you to do after all.
If you question it, or make up your own mind then your morality doesn't really come from the bible at all does it?


You're misinformed about the Bible. If you're going to criticize a religion, it might be best to read the literature, in this case... know the reasoning for the Old and New Testament.

>> ^treat:
Videos like these are simply incendiary and serve only to contribute to the hatred and violence which is so pervasive between separate beliefs systems to this day,


Really?

Then as a militant atheist, I'm gonna violently upvote this video. Take that, Christians!