This guy is full of false dichotomies and pretension. First, the whole "ritual" and "community" things are not specific to religion. Look at the art world, school, family life: all full of ritual. And the point about community has already been made above. Second, no one will look down on an atheist who likes aspects of culture and human thought/production linked to religion, be they architectural, textual or other.

He starts with the premise that it's the norm to know that believing in deities is non-sense and no-one does, and those who do do no harm. Well bullocks. The reason people are loud about arguing against superstitious beliefs is because they have dire consequences, especially when they are indoctrinated into vulnerable child minds who cannot oppose them (because not testable nor evidence-based). And that is a danger to humanity, period.

As for thinking about things, as it said above, education should take the place of giving people knowledge and material to be in awe of (e.g. anything by Carl Sagan) and philosophise about. The only reason the evangelicals/pentacostalists are convincing is because they are preaching to a crowd of indoctrinated sheep, making a conscious effort to bypass any critical thought. I think it would be terrible to "preach" that Shakespeare is wonderful. No. Live it. Learn to appreciate it critically. Or dislike it, but know why. And no, propaganda is never good. It is trying to imprint a message onto you without you questioning. No matter how "good" a message is, it should be up to the receiver to critically receive it, and accept/reject it based on their critical appraisal thereof.

Ugh, this guy annoyed me.

@dystopianfuturetoday:

I see what you're going for, so here's your Yes. Where our opinions diverge is a matter of perspective.

Slavery is not unique to the Black race, nor even Black Americans, it's a worldwide institution with ancient origins that is still practiced in parts of Africa TODAY. Every race on earth has at one time been enslaved, just as every race on earth has also enslaved other races. As horrible as it seems to us, for centuries slavery was accepted as necessary and a part of life. For Black Americans to feel singled out is, to me, just silly.

So enter the Civil War, a complex struggle involving myriad factors that became more about slavery about halfway through. Republicans ended slavery. Not that is was all sugar and poetry: Lincoln said it didn't matter if he had to keep slavery or end it, he would do whichever it took to save the Union. Lincoln did the paperwork but the Abolitionists did the real work.

We had a Civil Rights movement and it was just. (Now we have a Special Rights movement that is unjust, but that's another chapter).

I don't buy this crap about psychic injuries from slavery. And yes, here is the part where I provide the transcript of Bill Cosby's "Poundcake speech". I know you're going to have your reasons for not liking what he had to say (and I'm sure Jesse Jackson, who was right beside him was shocked and pissed) but all the same, please READ IT.


Yes, there was a time in America where lynchings were common, racism was institutional and opportunities for Blacks were severely limited. That time has passed. Yes, there are remnants of the klan out there, but they're not the ones forcing Blacks to drop out of school, disparage reading books and getting an education as "the White Man's Game" or impregnating young girls like it's nothing.

We've had generation after generation of immigrants now, from Vietnam, India, the failed soviet bloc. They came here with nothing and in a generation or two have risen. And if the excuse is, 'Well, they're not Black," here come Blacks from the Caribbean, working hard and doing just as well. All of these immigrant groups have one HUGE advantage: they haven't suffered decades of this American victim mentality.

I trust your sincerity and the sincerity of all the liberals who want to see Black Americans improve their lot (and they have, most are middle class). But there are forces that demand the dependency of Black Americans and use a victim mentality to get their votes. I don't see why anyone would heed voices that say, 'You Can't Do It'.


RE: the "science" article bashing conservatives. In Japan there are "scientists" whose entire output is exceptionalist-nationalist philosophy (nihonjinron) that is to be taken very seriously. This article is on the same level as, "liberals are better lovers".








>> ^dystopianfuturetoday:

qm - Imagine if you and the rest of your ethnic heritage were brought to this country as prisoners, to be sold as property to other people. You are bought and sold and expected to do hard labor without protest. Any resistance could mean your life, or your foot, so you quickly learn to submit yourself to the authority of the ruling racial class. Your ethnic heritage, as a whole, is kept in poverty and ignorance for many generations. Old proud traditions are beaten out of you, and new ones are created in secret, out of the watchful eye of your master. You cannot sing your music, but you can sing in the church choir, so you create your own new culture under the restrictions imposed by your masters.
Then a century down the road, it is decided that slavery is wrong and you are set free. Unfortunately for you, you are in your middle age with no money or education in a culture where you are thought of as subhuman. In this hostile environment, you are expected to compete with people who have been free all their lives, and more sinisterly, people who loathe you and are actively against your progress. They even create organizations to make life worse for you and to form lynch mobs to murder you and your kind.
This new generation continues to pass along the legacy of poverty, lack of education, self doubt, fear and shame to further generations. For the next few generations, laws are set up to discriminate against your people, and it is publicly acceptable to insult, attack and even kill your underclass with minimal consequences. There are new freedoms and a desire to rise above, but there are so very many cultural barriers.
Eventually society decides this underclass should have the same rights as everyone else, but at this point, the legacy of slavery has been imprinted on an entire culture for many generations - Hundreds of years of negative cultural conditioning. Although free in law, there is still much animosity aimed at your group. Not only are ou different in color and culture, but you also carry the stigma of being poor and not having access to the same level of education of the ruling racial class.
Eventually steps are taken to reverse this legacy of hate, poverty and slavery through government assistance programs, and while costly, they do yield success as your underclass rises in wealth and social acceptance. The fact that we, the racial ruling class, see them as equal and expect them to do as well as we do speaks greatly to the change in culture over the last half century. But, just are the legacy of slavery lives on in black culture, so does the legacy of hate live on in white culture. Groups of neo-confederate whites are angry that there is an effort to help remedy a problem created by our forefathers. They don't care whether or not these programs have been successful, they just hate the idea of this long hated underclass getting some help.
Just as the legacy of poverty has made it's way from generation to generation, so has the legacy of hate.
Perhaps the neo-confederates should take the log out of their own eye, before cataloging the failings of others. Or at least, they could attempt some understanding of why these stats are the way they are, how much progress has been made, and what could be done to stop these destructive legacies in the future.

Do you see what I'm going for here, qm? I'd love a yes, even if it comes with heavy reservations.

qm - Imagine if you and the rest of your ethnic heritage were brought to this country as prisoners, to be sold as property to other people. You are bought and sold and expected to do hard labor without protest. Any resistance could mean your life, or your foot, so you quickly learn to submit yourself to the authority of the ruling racial class. Your ethnic heritage, as a whole, is kept in poverty and ignorance for many generations. Old proud traditions are beaten out of you, and new ones are created in secret, out of the watchful eye of your master. You cannot sing your music, but you can sing in the church choir, so you create your own new culture under the restrictions imposed by your masters.

Then a century down the road, it is decided that slavery is wrong and you are set free. Unfortunately for you, you are in your middle age with no money or education in a culture where you are thought of as subhuman. In this hostile environment, you are expected to compete with people who have been free all their lives, and more sinisterly, people who loathe you and are actively against your progress. They even create organizations to make life worse for you and to form lynch mobs to murder you and your kind.

This new generation continues to pass along the legacy of poverty, lack of education, self doubt, fear and shame to further generations. For the next few generations, laws are set up to discriminate against your people, and it is publicly acceptable to insult, attack and even kill your underclass with minimal consequences. There are new freedoms and a desire to rise above, but there are so very many cultural barriers.

Eventually society decides this underclass should have the same rights as everyone else, but at this point, the legacy of slavery has been imprinted on an entire culture for many generations - Hundreds of years of negative cultural conditioning. Although free in law, there is still much animosity aimed at your group. Not only are ou different in color and culture, but you also carry the stigma of being poor and not having access to the same level of education of the ruling racial class.

Eventually steps are taken to reverse this legacy of hate, poverty and slavery through government assistance programs, and while costly, they do yield success as your underclass rises in wealth and social acceptance. The fact that we, the racial ruling class, see them as equal and expect them to do as well as we do speaks greatly to the change in culture over the last half century. But, just are the legacy of slavery lives on in black culture, so does the legacy of hate live on in white culture. Groups of neo-confederate whites are angry that there is an effort to help remedy a problem created by our forefathers. They don't care whether or not these programs have been successful, they just hate the idea of this long hated underclass getting some help.

Just as the legacy of poverty has made it's way from generation to generation, so has the legacy of hate.

Perhaps the neo-confederates should take the log out of their own eye, before cataloging the failings of others. Or at least, they could attempt some understanding of why these stats are the way they are, how much progress has been made, and what could be done to stop these destructive legacies in the future.


Do you see what I'm going for here, qm? I'd love a yes, even if it comes with heavy reservations.

She soooo reminds me of my son at that age. He's now 8 and still wants to be a paleontologist when he grows up. It always reminds me of this great Dinosaur knowledge vs age graph.

I took him to the Royal Tyrell Museum in Alberta for a couple days when he was 6 and he had the time of his life. We drove 13 hours to get there, but it was really worth it. We were in one of the workshops making fossil imprints and he was trying to correct some of the people when they were saying the wrong things about different dinosaurs.

But here is something that is true.... 80% of attacks on women are by single unarmed assailants. Men who prey on women are looking for a victim, not a fight.

Her over the top annoying story, that grated on my nerves from start to finish, shows those how those two facts should be imprinted in every woman's mind. So I posted the vid. As a public service announcement.

>> ^schlub:

I've heard this song SO many times that every nuance of it is imprinted perfectly in my memory. This guy does a pretty decent job but, he still misses the mark for sounding like Freddie. There are parts where he's really close but, mostly his voice is too "breathy". Very good attempt though!
Get your ears checked, MilkmanDan
>> ^MilkmanDan:
1) First, to my ear it is just so spot on that it seems almost unbelievable.
...


I figured that someone who was a bigger Queen fan would have a much better read on it than I did; if, say, someone was covering Metallica I think I'd be better able to pick up differences. On the other hand, I'm not much of a musician myself (dabble / have fun playing bass and guitar, but not well and I can't sing for s#it) so I'd still trust an expert's ear over my own.

Still, I stand by my assessment that to my ear he sounds very much like Freddie Mercury, to the point that I originally thought it might be lip-synching (although I'm now willing to accept he was singing it himself). I wouldn't have bet my life on it or anything, so I don't feel compelled to "get my ears checked" -- but I take no offense to your suggestion. Just glad to hear your comment as someone who is better able to compare to the studio recording than I am.

>> ^schlub:

I've heard this song SO many times that every nuance of it is imprinted perfectly in my memory. This guy does a pretty decent job but, he still misses the mark for sounding like Freddie. There are parts where he's really close but, mostly his voice is too "breathy". Very good attempt though!
Get your ears checked, MilkmanDan
>> ^MilkmanDan:
1) First, to my ear it is just so spot on that it seems almost unbelievable.


Reference material:



There's nothing wrong with MilkmanDan's ears my friend. Being a singer who has had to cover many different vocal styles myself and has also heard this song as well as most other Queen song many, many times, I listened to the two comparatively and I'm sorry to tell you but he's about as spot on as you can get without being Freddy himself. The main difference that I can hear between this guy's recording and the video you submitted is studio effects/mix. I'm sure this guy doesn't know exactly what effects were used during the recording so he did the best he could. I think Queen should hire his ass pronto and start touring.

I've heard this song SO many times that every nuance of it is imprinted perfectly in my memory. This guy does a pretty decent job but, he still misses the mark for sounding like Freddie. There are parts where he's really close but, mostly his voice is too "breathy". Very good attempt though!

Get your ears checked, MilkmanDan

>> ^MilkmanDan:

1) First, to my ear it is just so spot on that it seems almost unbelievable.



Reference material:

It isn't that the bible is the origin of morality, it is that God is the lawgiver who has written His moral law on our hearts. Humans know what is right and wrong because their God given conscience informs them. We both know murder is wrong, just by intuition alone. Why? Because some things are in fact absolutely and universally wrong. If we seem to share any similiarites with the animal kingdom in spirit, it is because we all have a common design.

A point of fact is that sin is what keeps us separated from God. It is not that God is hiding from you, it is that we are born spiritually dead because of sin and thus spiritually separated from a Holy God.

Isaiah 59:2 (NIV) But your iniquities have separated you from
your God; your sins have hidden his face from you, so that he will
not hear.

This is the reason Jesus came, to reconcile us to God. The wages of sin is death, and He paid that price for us, so that we could be forgiven and receieve eternal life.

>> ^swedishfriend:
>> ^gwiz665:
Morality is what we make of it. There is no rulebook against which we can measure it. We weigh it in our experiences and in what our ancestors taught us. Our evolutionary development has also imprinted certain aspects, which stay with us, like community building and "people skills".
Nature and nurture, not "god did it".
There is zero evidence that points to the bible being the origin of any morality at all, neither is a supernatural being which happens to hide whenever we look for it.
Even if there was evidence that pointed to the bible as the rule of morals, would we even want that? It's antiquated and dare I say, evil?

This is exactly it. There is plenty of evidence to show that nature through evolution does give us encouragement or discouragement in response to threat, empathy, needs, etc. What triggers those emotions and how we deal with those emotions are influenced by culture. People have lived together for millions of years before the Bible or Christianity or even before the written word. Cooperation in order to survive and even selfless sacrifice to save someone else is something we see in many social animals not just ourselves. Morality is a reasoned thing combined with a natural tendency and always has been. Religions come from people and while religion can influence other people they are initially created by people and their culture. Why nature made us this way I don't know but I know that something experienced by a few people 2000 years ago did not create the concept of morality nor does it influence all the humans and other social animals who have never heard of religion of any kind who still manage to have a concept of how to treat each other well in order for all in the group to prosper.
-Karl

>> ^gwiz665:

Morality is what we make of it. There is no rulebook against which we can measure it. We weigh it in our experiences and in what our ancestors taught us. Our evolutionary development has also imprinted certain aspects, which stay with us, like community building and "people skills".
Nature and nurture, not "god did it".
There is zero evidence that points to the bible being the origin of any morality at all, neither is a supernatural being which happens to hide whenever we look for it.
Even if there was evidence that pointed to the bible as the rule of morals, would we even want that? It's antiquated and dare I say, evil?


This is exactly it. There is plenty of evidence to show that nature through evolution does give us encouragement or discouragement in response to threat, empathy, needs, etc. What triggers those emotions and how we deal with those emotions are influenced by culture. People have lived together for millions of years before the Bible or Christianity or even before the written word. Cooperation in order to survive and even selfless sacrifice to save someone else is something we see in many social animals not just ourselves. Morality is a reasoned thing combined with a natural tendency and always has been. Religions come from people and while religion can influence other people they are initially created by people and their culture. Why nature made us this way I don't know but I know that something experienced by a few people 2000 years ago did not create the concept of morality nor does it influence all the humans and other social animals who have never heard of religion of any kind who still manage to have a concept of how to treat each other well in order for all in the group to prosper.

-Karl

Morality is what we make of it. There is no rulebook against which we can measure it. We weigh it in our experiences and in what our ancestors taught us. Our evolutionary development has also imprinted certain aspects, which stay with us, like community building and "people skills".

Nature and nurture, not "god did it".

There is zero evidence that points to the bible being the origin of any morality at all, neither is a supernatural being which happens to hide whenever we look for it.

Even if there was evidence that pointed to the bible as the rule of morals, would we even want that? It's antiquated and dare I say, evil?

Just added to my instant queue. I can't wait for this horrid flick to imprint itself upon my memory! *promote

>> ^deathcow:

I can tell by your forehead that you drive FORD cars.


Used to have a 93 mustang. Till a soccer mom in an SUV pulled out in front of me and I nailed her. Airbag went off and instead of the plastic splitting for deployment the whole thing was ripped off. The force of the bag going off imprinted SRS and a little Mustang emblem from the plastic in to my forearm. To this day if I get a little sun or tan it shows up really bright.

With extreme prejudice.
>> ^burdturgler:

No hard feelings. I'd accept your apology if you offered one. But the way I understand it, you're banned.
In reply to this comment by Peckinpaw:
hey man, no hard feelings-you might not like what I have to, or have ever had to say but i ain't no more a racist than a canna creamed corn-Mind You, I'm a victim of my imprints and societal 'psycho-cybernetic shit-think that we all are-
I was always on yer case in days past, because of yer 'penchant for the sophomoric comments never knew yer make and model till the fateful blow-out day-Dude, I could care what yer ethnic orientation is, I see words and keystrokes and refer to all us monkeys as monkeys-even in everyday conversation....I'm me.-Now ya know-you had AssBurger-syndrome man backing you on my ban as well, n' let him dooit! I was 'pissed!! Peace w/a view2understanding-Brian
In reply to this comment by burdturgler:
hello choggie

No hard feelings. I'd accept your apology if you offered one. But the way I understand it, you're banned.

In reply to this comment by Peckinpaw:
hey man, no hard feelings-you might not like what I have to, or have ever had to say but i ain't no more a racist than a canna creamed corn-Mind You, I'm a victim of my imprints and societal 'psycho-cybernetic shit-think that we all are-

I was always on yer case in days past, because of yer 'penchant for the sophomoric comments never knew yer make and model till the fateful blow-out day-Dude, I could care what yer ethnic orientation is, I see words and keystrokes and refer to all us monkeys as monkeys-even in everyday conversation....I'm me.-Now ya know-you had AssBurger-syndrome man backing you on my ban as well, n' let him dooit! I was 'pissed!! Peace w/a view2understanding-Brian
In reply to this comment by burdturgler:
hello choggie