RFlagg, do you realize nearly 1/3 of the worlds population identifies as Christian? I’m not sure why you think the Republican party is the standard bearer for Christ in the world, but the majority of Christians don’t live in Western democracies. About a quarter billion of them face daily persecution from hostile governments. You are grossly mischaracterizing the faith by conflating it with the worst elements of the American church, which actually in many Christian circles is commonly referred to as the church of Laodicia. Have you ever read Christs letter to the church of Laodicia? Its in Revelation chapter 3.

So you may be shocked to find out that a lot of Christians will agree with you that the American church is backslidden. I also agree with you that too many Christians are too political and have said and done things which are morally repugnant.

I support this president, I also supported the president before him. Christians are commanded in Romans 13 to support and pray for our leaders. It doesn’t mean that we have to agree with them. I certainly didn’t agree with how the church as a whole overlooked quite a bit about Trump because of their desire to win a political victory. That doesn’t mean that any Christian who voted for or supports Trump is anything like what you described, so filled with hate. Many of us hate what is happening to the country, but we don’t hate the people who are doing it.

Your testimony about finding Christ revolves around attending church services and watching TBN and Fox News. Your reason for falling away stemmed from your disillusionment and disgust with the republican party. All of that is really the epitome of cultural Christianity. You may have had an experience, or felt some emotions, but you weren’t changed. There are millions of people sitting in pews all across America who are in the same situation; completely lost and thinking they are okay. This is the unfortunate side-effect of post-Christian culture; everyone has heard of Jesus and no one knows how to be saved or even what that means. They just know that if they add Jesus to their life, they will somehow make it to Heaven. So they just slap a Jesus sticker on everything they’re doing. They are still the same old rotten people, but now Jesus is with them and justifies all of their bad behavior. That’s cultural Christianity. Christianity is spiritual, not cultural.

John 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God

You need to be born again, RFlagg, and that didn’t happen to you. It can happen to you if you surrender your life to Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior. Attending church services won’t make that happen for you. Attending church doesn’t make you a Christian. Watching Christian programming on TV, conservative news shows, and agreeing with creation science doesn’t make you a Christian. You become a Christian when you repent of your sin and fully surrender your life to Jesus Christ. It is at that moment that He will make you into a new person. It’s so simple a child could understand it but man has overcomplicated it to the point of totally distorting the message of the gospel.

I think this statement illustrates your issue “If being in Heaven means being around the people who say they will go, Trump supporters, then Hell is a billion times better.”

You’re looking to man instead of God. It’s God that you have to contend with, not man. As a person who has rejected Christ, you are under Gods judgment and that is why you need Christ. It’s easy to say I’d rather be in hell, but I can guarantee you that no one in hell currently feels that way. Rather they are in eternal misery because they forfeited their eternal life with God. What did they forfeit it for? Sin, plain and simple. Your issue is sin and not the many reasons you have come up with to reject the Lord.

"The fact that God doesn't care enough to tell his followers that they are following the literal antichrist system, is telling. "

The Lord has detailed everything to do with that in the scriptures. Jesus railed on the Pharisees for exactly the same thing:

Luke 12:54-56

Then He also said to the multitudes, “Whenever you see a cloud rising out of the west, immediately you say, ‘A shower is coming’; and so it is. And when you see the south wind blow, you say, ‘There will be hot weather’; and there is. Hypocrites! You can discern the face of the sky and of the earth, but how is it you do not discern this time?

The Lord outlined how the end times will proceed in the scriptures. There isn't much excuse for not understanding the times that we are living in. There will be a one world government run by the Antichrist, and the whole world will worship him.

"I do appreciate the higher degree of kindness you tend to show than certain others, and my family... almost all Trump supporters I personally know..."

Thank you, and I appreciate that you are willing to engage and talk about spiritual matters with me without trying to belittle me. That's not typical and I appreciate your civility friend.

Overall I am saying this to you because I care about you, not because I am judging you. I need Christ as much as you do RFlagg. It’s because of that, that I know how much you need Him that I am writing this to you. God bless.

If being in Heaven means being around the people who say they will go, Trump supporters, then Hell is a billion times better. The fact that God doesn't care enough to tell his followers that they are following the literal antichrist system, is telling.

Trump Supporters... They HATE LGBTQIA people. They HATE the needy and the poor. They HATE scientific truth, like climate change. They are filled with HATE for foreigners. They LOVE wealth and inequality. They LOVE greed. They LOVE war. Every Trump supporter is like that. They are all bigoted people.

And when I say all Trump supporters, I mean damn near all the ones I personally know. My family, the people I work with. All evil, bigoted people who thump their chest about how Christian they are, and how anyone who reads the Bible would have to be Republican. Who agree with Jerry Falwell Jr. how those who don't support Trump are immoral. They are all stuck in this evangelical cult of Trump.

The day I see the Love of Christ from Republican Christians in masse, will be a miracle. But every fucking day I have to listen to Fox news near all day every day. I have to listen to listen to provable lies that are being taken as gospel, and having to hear how everyone who isn't supporting Trump is evil and against Christ.

Now you may argue that doesn't represent all Christians. But that clearly represents the vast majority of those who care to vote, and certainly of the kids in this video.

Also I wouldn't say I was a cultural Christian at all. My family was, we went to church once a week. Then I got serious about it. I started watching TBN all the time. Started going to an evangelical church. Blasted Democrats and anybody who wouldn't trust Fox News and Fox News alone (my prior comments as Charon seem to have been purged, but I'd blast evolution, trust only in Fox). I went 3 services a week. I was one of those people who'd make sure I said "Merry Christmas" just to be sure people got the message. As I've said before, the initial moment was realizing that the GOP was becoming more and more like the antichrist, and that it was the polar opposite of what Christ himself would want. I became a Libertarian, backed off the 3 services a week to just one, mostly in search of a church that wasn't practically telling people that Republican is the only way a real Christian could vote. Then in 2008 at the Republican debate when a room full of pro-life Christians started chanting "Let him die! Let him die!" with great enthusiasm, about a guy not having insurance and what should happen to him... that was the catalyst that opened the door to everything being so wrong. to say "this... this whole thing is wrong..." And then God did nothing. Christ did nothing. It's gotten a billion times worse since then. Those type of Christians continue to be the main reason people have the same moment where they go... no... and move on. I went, became Pagan for a time, and found it just as connecting to God, at least for those who were serious about it, and empathy says, if they are having just as sincere a relationship with their God as Christians have with God, then it is all equal... and the logic then said, "or not equal, and just as stupid".

Now perhaps I wouldn't be so anti-Christian if I wasn't surrounded by them at work, and having to live with people I'd shit and piss on their grave if their eventual grave wasn't attached to my sister's. Then again, I'd see the news of what these people are doing to this country, fucking it over for profit, and hurting the very people Christ said to help, and doing so in Christ's name... which is the technical definition of using the Lord's name in vain, not just saying something like "Jesus Christ" in exasperation. I do put up with my girlfriend being Christian, though it and her high sex drive are the two things that most drive me nuts... but beggars can't be choosers, and marriage is the only way out of this hell hole of being with my parents at 50 fucking years old... at least until child support goes away...

NOBODY is seeing the love of Christ demonstrated by people like my family, 80-95% of the people at work, Fox, TBN, CBN, 700 Club, Jim Baker, and the like. And they do represent the public image of Christianity. If the moderates and liberal Christians are the majority of Christians, then they don't make their voice known, they don't vote in opposition to these sort of people in this video and on Fox. So either God isn't moving their hearts, they don't care, or God doesn't exist. Even if he does, if my family, Bob, the people I work with, these kids, the other Trump supporters are the main ones there, then I don't want to have to be around them forever, it's bad enough being around them for a short life. Want people to come to God, then start with those sort of people and get them to see how they are doing more harm than good. They have to more at making the world a better place than they do, to leave the world in better shape for centuries to come. Not to take it all for now, not to assume Christ is coming back soon, but always practice he's 50,000 years from coming back... and 1,000 years from now, it's still 50,000 years from then. To act the way Christ said to act, not the greedy fucks that make up the GOP. To actually show the love he showed. He hung out with sinners, and railed against those who were walking around thumping their chest about how holy they are, yet these GOP Christians are thumping their chests, and shunning those who sin differently.

Anyhow I could rant on, but that's enough for now. I do appreciate the higher degree of kindness you tend to show than certain others, and my family... almost all Trump supporters I personally know...

I don't get how Trump and the GOP say the Democrats need to be willing to negotiate. They are offering $1.6 Billion in additional funding. But Trump is acting like Veruca Salt, and stomping his feet, saying he wants $5.7 Billion, and he wants it now. That's not how negotiations work. You want $5.7, they offer $1.6, you come down to say $4.6, they come back at $2.3, you come back with $4 and permanent residence status for Dreamers, they come back with $3 and permanent resident status, then you meet at $3.5 and permanent resident status. You don't just keep acting like a child throwing a temper tantrum and demanding the $5.7, and if you don't get it, the other side is the one's being unreasonable.

The "Pro-life" party, that loves the death penalty and war, so not really pro-life at all, is now holding millions of Americans (800k, plus their families, plus the millions of people who depend on those services) hostage in an act of economic terrorism, until the other side fully caves into their demands. They are the ones not willing to negotiate, but are doing some 1984 level doublespeak, and blaming it all on the Democrats. And the Fox News types are eating it up, which is probably why Trump thinks he's winning. "Just look. Steve says I'm doing good and that all real Americans support me."

They need to pass a law, that Congress, their aids and staff, the President, their aids and staff, the White House aids and staff... all don't get paid on any shutdown. If they've already given up their salary (I love how Trump followers commend Trump for giving up his salary, while ignoring he makes more a year off the Secret Service than he would in years of salary) then they have to reimburse that salary they would have made in that time. Congress and the President may not take back pay, and it takes a 60% vote to authorize the aids and staff back pay, but only if all other Federal workers also get their back pay first in a separate and prior authorization.

"There is plenty of scum to go around on both sides."

Ahh the classic false equivalency that Trump supporters often resort to.

First of all, every child should be taught at a young age that just because other children may act like little shits, that doesn't mean they can. The amount of functional adult Trump supporters who use "the Democrats are bad too!" as an excuse for Trump's behavior is just astounding. It's really just a pathetic diversionary tactic used to avoid discussing the issues at hand.

Second, your claim that Democrats are just as cruel is simply not true. Blaming Democrats for the very thing Trump is guilty of is a common smear tactic employed by extremist right wing propaganda.

Take Trump's zero tolerance policy which separated minors from their families for example. Right wing propaganda outlets like OAN love showing pictures of children housed alone in Obama era detention facilities and cry foul at the liberal media at the lack of coverage. The reality is that Obama faced a huge surge of thousand of unaccompanied minors from south america in 2014 who were detained. So yes, thousands of children were detained, but they were NOT separated from the families in the first place.

And while some families were separated during Obama's tenure, Obama's policies tried to limit this as much as possible. It is a far cry from what Trump's zero tolerance policy accomplished. The "liberal" media did not report this under Obama OR Bush simply because it was not an issue. If you believed that there was unfair media coverage for Trump on this issue, then you were lied to and manipulated. Its part of what we discussed earlier how Trump uses lies to discredit the media and further erode our democracy.

The point is that right wing propaganda and Trump himself routinely uses lies and deception to paint himself as the target of a "liberal media bias" that they themselves manufactured. And his gullible supporters like yourself love believing in his victim complex. If you don't believe me, then just refer to non partisan international sources like the BBC and you'll soon discover that Trump is just as shitty from an impartial view as the "biased liberal media" portrays him.

Both sides are not the same, no matter what lies Trump and Fox News et al. tries to tell you. And there are plenty of respectable media sources which are not CNN which also exposes Trump for the lying scum that he is.

I do place CNN and Fox in the same category.
That is how low CNN has sunk and how much better Fox has become in my experiences watching what amounts to garbage reporting on a whole.
Trump did this today blah blah blah but yes he still lusts after his daughter.
He is actually saying she is just a really hot looking young woman as he works in that business but lets go there anyway.
Fox is not pure propaganda.
You don't watch it enough to see the right people to know of what of you speak.
I don't simply watch what appeals to me or justifies my point of view which too many people like you are doing with the rise of the internet.
Relying on late night comedy shows who never show Fox News or Trump saying anything good is useless too.
Shep Smith, Bret Baier and Chris Wallace are pretty decent at giving you the news.
Yes Fox is a joke at times and seems to be in Trumps pocket but there is good reporting on there and some good reporters.
You just have to skip the garbage like Hannity a lot of the time and the judge jeannie idiot all of the time.
Laura Ingram seems to be there just to act the asshole.
Tucker can be good sometimes looking at the current insane trends.
I watch several sources everyday to get an overall view on how things get reported and it is eye opening.
I never liked what the Republicans and Fox did to Obama but 2 wrongs don't make a right and after all Fox News is just entertainment right?
CNN has been around how long?
It was once very respected.
You don't seem to be grasping my point.
I don't like most of how Trump does things.
Even when he is doing something good he ruins it sometimes by the way he words it.
I think he is being led by people and could have been a lot more palpable to the left but they have pulled the strings and yanked him back most everytime.
The birther thing showed how low class he will always be despite his money and gross looking home with all the ugly so called appointments.
I am saying he is playing the media and it is suffering as a result and the media by acting unprofessionally is playing along.

I would disagree on your description of the news media as it stands today.
I refuse to call it unbiased when I see an agenda,
an obvious agenda to discredit Trump at most anything he does.
CNN isn't the only trashy one.
I stick Fox in there as well but both have moments of clarity when they do simply report the news without adding their own bias to it or even editing out certain parts to make it look worse.
As an example I used to hate that Gutfield character on Fox News but anymore I find I agree with him on the insanity going on.
He has made several jabs at Trump as well.
How can you not call CNN fake news when the majority of their programming is all about Trump in a negative light?
The day of the mass shooting of Jews CNN said one minute they needed to try to cool things off with Trump etc and the next I knew they were right back bashing him.
I'd say about half an hour tops they held off the bashing.
If you are insanely jealous of Trumps winning ways than I can see how you may think CNN is legit.
Acosta wasn't even close to being civil.
Watch the original clip again and see how long he grandstanded for.
He does this far too often.
If you are that dense you need Jim Acosta to harass the President to show you what's up then I feel bad for you.
He could be much more effective if he was more professional and probably a much greater thorn in Trumps side.

They will admit to the economy at times seeing as they are well paid folks with many plans that are now thriving with Trumps measures.
You can see it in their eyes lol.
The Whitehouse is NOT just any old place it deserves a measure of respect.
I am well aware of how a democracy works and how people opposed to Trump are committing criminal acts in it's name far worse than the crooks Trump so stupidly employed in order to at first keep him out of office and then to remove him once he got in.
I'm telling you folks this stupidity by the media is only turning more and more folks on the fence over to Trumps camp.
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/feinstein-urged-obama-in-2014-to-use-broad-power-to-limit-immigration
I know... it's Fox News but sometimes they are the only ones who will look for this sort of thing.
It certainly isn't in CNN's interest to tell the truth when they claim anything Trump does is racist to address the issue of the caravans.
Some see him as a breath of fresh air (despite his shameful baiting of bigots) when he refuses to be a victim of the all powerful media.
Myself included but I wouldn't have voted for him.
I never watched one episode of his show and never will but I think he has demonstrated that people are becoming tired of all the daily outrage at things we haven't yet fixed even though it may be something vague and we haven't even had time to try to adapt.
Maybe I'm just getting old and not as easily manipulated...

That's not how democracy or press conferences work.

1: journalists absolutely do NOT have to accept a politicians answer. They are fully entitled to demand a real answer.

2: they're also entitled to follow up questions. Acostas behaviour is completely normal for any member of the press and far less "rude" than anything Fox News did to Obama.

And as for CNN coverage of Trump's achievements....
*related=https://videosift.com/video/CNN-Red-Pills-itself-The-Economy-is-GREAT

Yeah seriously, how dare he provoke the president by asking questions that Trump doesn't want to answer. CNN should go to North Korea and learn how to properly respect the president - you should only ask positive things about our Great Leader! If Fox News can tout the official party line, why can't every one else?

Them democrats caring about such silly things like a free press - how childish!

Denmark Responds To Fox News Fantasy With Facts has been added as a related post - related requested by Zawash.

*related=https://videosift.com/video/Denmark-Responds-To-Fox-News-Fantasy-With-Facts

Fox News sooo.... True? Unbiased.

Warren could be good. I'm not 100% sold that she can play the political game particularly well -- the "Pocahontas" thing should have been pretty gracefully manageable, but she kinda fumbled there a bit. Still, if the Democrat primary system can avoid being the train wreck it was leading up to 2016, I think she could go through that and prove that she's got what it takes. So, maybe.

I love Sanders, but he's divisive because of the "Socialist" thing, which is still quite a scary word for Cold War-era people. I think that is surmountable by calmly explaining exactly what his brand of Democratic Socialism means, but there's always going to be that easy Fox News narrative against him. So between that, age, and other factors, he's not a slam dunk.

Obama? I'm assuming you mean Michelle? Name recognition yes. Firsthand political experience, not so much. I don't think I've ever heard her say anything about wanting to get into politics directly.

I concur about Avenatti.

I hope the D's don't screw this up. All of these celebrity / political celebrity candidates seem risky and hit or miss to me. Might be better to go with a relative unknown -- somebody who's been through a hairy campaign or two (because we know Trump will attack and try to rattle) and knows how to walk the line between giving those attacks legitimacy by responding to them and seeming too milquetoasty by ignoring them. (Barack) Obama was quite good at having that calm outer demeanor while also having a quick wit and knowing when to get counter-jabs in. Seems like someone with those kinds of skills could really lure Trump into a bunch of pitfalls.

I always find it funny when someone says kaep should have done it somewhere else or that its the wrong venue? What was the right venue? would you have listened to him if he hada big press conference? Would you have proclaimed that police brutality is a thing? Would you have gone to a symposium on police brutality if kaep wanted to discus things?

This decision had the biggest impact to bring it to peoples attentions, its sad that the message has been shifted to that of players protesting the military, which doesnt make sense. Protesting because they want more money? That isnt how players go about making more money. (Holding out for more money like bell is doing and not getting fantasy points is how its done). The fact that people talk about it means the message is on peopels minds, and sadly its either the wrong message or the right one in their heads.

The fact that the women had to exclaim the reason he was removing the plate was because of "our lands" "our America" "our people" and not for BLM already shows shes right leaning and wouldn't care for any reason but waht fox news gives her.

I think it was probably a sifted video that first got me to look up Kaepernick's actual statements from about 2 years ago when he started sitting out the anthem in protest. There's a great post-game interview where he made himself available and answered questions from many reporters etc. about his motivations, etc.


To me, it seems impossible to watch that with an open mind and come away with the Fox News narrative on the guy intact. He straight-up says that it wasn't ever meant to be taken as a slight on the military at all. He clearly and rather eloquently explains what it was/is about for him. He acknowledged that there would likely be consequences, which certainly came true.

Maybe he wouldn't be a QB in the NFL even if he'd have just kept quiet and been a good little conformist, but he got to a point where he didn't feel he could do that.

So, at least in my eyes, kudos to him for standing up for what he believes in. Even after losing his primary soapbox (being an NFL player), he's still putting the issue out there with Nike's help. I don't necessarily trust their motivations -- all publicity is good publicity, after all -- but after having heard his own statements I sure as hell trust his as being 100% genuine.