>> ^GeeSussFreeK:
If you can find something more monolithic and impenetrable than the DOD, Pentagon, and HLS let me know, I'll bake you some cookies!


Wall Street investment banks.

Cookies, please!

If you can find something more monolithic and impenetrable than the DOD, Pentagon, and HLS let me know, I'll bake you some cookies!

>> ^thinker247:
While I am one to never believe anything my government tells me, I find it highly improbable that anybody but the 19 hijackers caused the events of September 11th. But to play devil's advocate, let me for a minute suspend my belief and agree with the "truthers" that my government perpetrated an act of terrorism against itself.
Why?
In order to invade Afghanistan to plunder its oil? We already had bin Laden on the FBI's Most Wanted List for the bombings of U.S. Embassies in Tanzania and Kenya. We easily could have invaded under the pretense of finding and extracting bin Laden (and the Taliban and al-Qaeda), because that's exactly what we did after September 11th.
In order to invade Iraq under the banner of anti-terrorism? Hussein had already defied U.N. weapons inspectors for over a decade and Bush was never the type to ask permission, so we didn't need September 11th to justify illegally invading a sovereign nation. We did it anyway.
In order to enact greater restrictions upon the citizens by inducing their fear response? Hell, as a general populace we're lemmings. The Bush administration certainly did not need to kill 3000 people in order to take away our liberties. We gladly give them up whenever anybody in authority asks.
I have yet to hear a rational answer to the question of "Why?" But I'm all ears.


niiiice.
ask a question and then propose possible hypothesis which of course you then dismantle.
let me preface this by stating i am not a "truther" and am not as convinced as my friend rougy is concerning 9/11.
that being said,the US government has never,in my opinion,given this a proper investigation.
let me give you an example:
lewinsky and the impeachment of bill clinton =168 million dollars.
9/11 investigation=6 million dollars
and lets be clear here.the governments version of what happened on 9/11 is itself a conspiracy theory and one that does not hold up well under closer scrutiny.
who is responsible? i do not know and neither do you but i think it prudent to not only ask questions but be allowed to ask those questions.
agree?
now...
as for YOUR question thinker247.
why?
i presume you are asking for motive.
ok.
1.lusitania
2.reichsthag
3.gulf of tonkin
these are all false flag operations and all preceded war.WW!,WW2 and vietnam respectively.i could mention the oil embargo on japan but that is a lengthy conversation.
what ARE the motives for war?
they have always been unequivocally about:
1.land/labor/resources/trade
how does a government,crown or ruling entity get its poorest,least educated and therefore most expendable to go fight and die for something the ruling class wishes?
1.propaganda.
which creates a "fighting spirit".
for thousands of years religion was the impetus to create this spirit but for the last hundred years it has been nationalism but it is ALWAYS the F>E>A>R that is the true driving force.
now that we have established a basis for war let us get to the heart of your question.
since i am not privy to secret documents i must make my answer based on conjecture.i shall do my best.
why would the US government use 9/11 (by action or by proxy) to change 200 years of national defensive posturing to one of "pre-emptive" and declare a war,not on any person or nation but one against an ephemeral opponent?the "war on terror".
1.war is HUGE business and the DOD has been one of the top 10 lobbyists since 1962.
2.saddam hussein,having been bombed for over 10 years straight(fact,look it up) along with sanctions and that ridiculous "oil for food" threatened to change iraq's oil transactions from the american dollar to the euro(fact,look it up)which would have cost the US billions if not trillions.seeing that every oil transaction is done in american dollars.it is the world reserve currency (not for much longer).
3.uzbekisthan has one the last and richest oil and natural gas left in the world.a pipeline which was denied by turkey (that has since changed,but for europes benefit,not america) is being built right now...
where?
ill give ya a guess.
iraq.
and do you know where it will lead into?
want to try another guess?
afghanistan.

those are just a few off the top of my head.i could take the time to be more concise and specific but this is a comment section.
maybe we have differing political philosophies thinker247.i do not trust government nor power because that power historically has ALWAYS attempted to garner more power for itself at the expense of liberty,freedom and the common good of society.
so while i dont think the US government attacked the twin towers,i believe they ALLOWED it.
what evidence do i have? none.and any evidence we could have gotten has been destroyed.
but i was military for a number of years and unless they have gotten lazy and stupid there is no way that would have happened.
could i be wrong?you betcha.
but unlike you i do not trust government and neither should you because historically,governments will abuse whatever powers they have and take your rights away as fast as they are allowed to.
might i recommend:
1.bryzinski "the grand chessboard"
2.naomi klein "the shock doctrine"
3.chalmers johnson "blowback"
hell...just go the PNAC website they practically lay it out for you and that minority controlled the government for 8 years.
history is the greatest teacher and it is your friend.
i have enjoyed this conversation thinker247.

IT could be a skill thing i think if your moderately good at FPS and you have abunch of mates of simular ablity then you will probably enjoy it.

For example i Have never felt tense in L4d , but i have watched people play and they seem to get very tense and feal under pressure its as if they are unaware of how predictable the game is or how obvious it is if its a win or lose situation , l4d never feals like a fight for me its always a blatant win or lose situation.

I used to play Alot of q3 Unreal tournament , and Instagib cs 1.6 Dod And red Orchestra I also love driving sims Rfactor Iracing LFS . It could just be the case that i find the core of LFD to easy and thats why for me the other aspects are emphasized. I realy like games that are incredably difficult but 90 -100% fair in terms of win lose scenario.

This could also be why Manny people i think enjoy it more on the 360 , due to the way the 360pad limits the players ability to move around it would probably make the game play more suspenseful if i ever get a 360 ill give it a try and see if it makes it more enjoyable for me as im pritty terrable at console FPS games , Bar golden eye on the n64.

The whole thing is im convinced that L4D is a casual game. that's not a bad thing I just think its almost ashamed that its a casual game , Id probably enjoy it more if it was a bit more out Like say showing points gained each time you shoot a zombie say points multiplier for getting head shots (and showing this during game play), that way players who have more skill at the fps element could really strive to get head shots and be rewarded for it.

I think the reasoning valve have not made scoring more transparent is that they want to try and make it emersive but i find the immersion in L4D quite comedic its certainly not a scary game , also they could just have the score eliment in some of the Multilayer modes not the traditoinal cmpagns.

Its weard actually if it was presented more a casual game i think i would really enjoy it I love stuff like Peggle , Mario cart , Mashed ,

perhaps a bit presumptuous but if that was his DoD ID card at the time he got out.........a fucking E-1?!

A fucking cherry ass private?!

confirms my suspicion that all privates are fucking water headed tards

Memorare, you took my quote completely out of context. I was responding to the allegation that the towers were brought down because of a potentially costly asbestos clean up coupled with a cover up of investigations of Enron, WorldCom and DoD. I don't deny that evil people will make war for financial and political gains, I just don't think this event was perpetrated by our government or was allowed to happen through inaction.

Just so I'm clear about what you are implying: the WTC and surrounding buildings were brought down by loaded passenger jets because of costly asbestos issues in combination with a cover up of the Enron and WorldCom investigations, and part of the Pentagon was destroyed to hide an internal DoD investigation. What about the plance crash in PA? Just theatrics to make it all seem reasonable?

Do you really believe that there are people in this world that are so evil that they believe they are justified in making this happen at the cost of thousands of lives, and who would actually go through with it? And do you really believe that the people that helped said evil people are so loyal that none of them have come forward with evidence in the 8 years since? These are evil people you are talking about, corrupted and driven only by money and power, so why hasn't anyone of the thousands of required to make this plan happen come forward and written a book or given interviews that would earn them millions in fees? How many conspiracies of government have ever gone on without at least one person speaking up and bringing things to light?

You must live in a sad, fucked up little world if you really believe any of this.

Update on the story: http://www.videosift.com/video/Keith-Olbermann-s-Worst-Person-in-The-World-1

Since Cook was a volunteer, he could chose whether or not to go. However, as a civilian, he was a DOD contractor. Well the military has severed that relationship, so Mr. Cook is now jobless.

Ugh, so much stupidity in this clip. Forgive me for ranting.

"Air Force and DoD policy prohibit support for events which appear to endorse, selectively benefit, or favor any special interest group, religious or ideological movement."

Sounds like a good policy and jdbates is right, they should've been enforcing that for the past 42 years.

Notice Fox labels this as a "patriotic rally" request (and later wonders, "Rally too 'Christian' in nature?"). Uh, the event is called the "God and Country" rally. This offended moron (Reverend Patrick Mahoney) from the Christian Defense Coalition goes on to say that these flyovers were not to promote or endorse any religion. Right.

THEN he says, "I think that we are wondering, when we look at President Obama, 'Is there a culture of hostility toward expressions of faith in the public square, particularly Christian?'" Oh golly gee, I thought this was just an innocent patriotic rally having nothing to do with any religion!

Now he's going to file a Freedom of Information Act request to "ensure that no American citizen/group is denied access to the public square because of their faith tradition." And repeats that over and over. What does that have to do with anything? When was anyone denied access to the public square? You couldn't get the Air Force to do a flyover for you. Boo-fucking-hoo.

And Gretchen is right, God is still on our money (has been since 1957). They should fix that.

She also has empty, blank, crazy bug-eyes that make my spine shiver.

Dod Gamn I love this show.

Seriously, slap a lies on this video. What a CATO nutjob usual lack of facts. (Penn is the biggest hypocrite). There are plenty of IP4, and people can give them back.

Each one of these is over 16 million addresses.
http://www.iana.org/assignments/ipv4-address-space/

I mean the DoD has over 150 million addresses.
Here's a map if you've never seen it.
http://dd.dynamicdiagrams.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/12/IP-map.gif

Imagine a world where the machines take over... because they are afraid of having their DOD budgets slashed.

I disagree QM,

The thing is tax cuts cannot work in the current economic climate. It's just counter productive for economic growth mostly because tax cuts are not effective when people don't have jobs and we live at a time when lending is being slashed. Consumers are also high in personal debt as a whole, so you have saving and debt repayment going on at the same time. This is a halt of all economic activity. You need an external factor to incite economy activity in economy as a whole. This is why there is a stimulus plan.

I agree that the stimulus plan is less then effective, I don't know that there isn't much overwatch in how exactly the money will be applied. I also think it would have been beneficial to start to defund or merge major governmental bodies that have little to no relevance now, specifically the department of education and energy. There needs to be a serious revaluation of DOD spending as a whole. There are far too many projects that are undertaken as matters of national security that are nothing more then R&D by the defense industry, that are then sold back to the government as private products.

However there is alot of ridiculous opposition to alot of things Obama is doing, and he is under pressure to impose a plan right now then later.

The republicans are effectively shooting themselves in the foot, instead of being involved in the process to reduce the government growth and try minimize cost they are fighting against a scheme to help the American people. It will not win them any favors when they talk of saving American jobs but did not help pass this stimulus. This will only further decline their relevancy to the fringe of the US voter public.

Listening to Rush Limbuagh, apologizing to him only makes Rush representative of the GOP as whole to the US. That is being rude, insulting and completely hypocritical without offering any solutions. Instead of actually regrouping and reforming the GOP they are further sliding into irrelevancy.

>> ^quantumushroom:
Media stooge: "THIS IS AN OUTRAGE! BUSH IS WASTING MONEY ON EXPENSIVE TOYS WHILE PEOPLE ARE HOMELESS!"



Two points:
1) I don't think I ever heard any pundit say something like that because Bush never had the intellectual curiosity to want cool new toys.

which leads me to...

2) Unless you consider Bush's expensive toys to be DoD masturbatory dreams like missile 'defense', in which case we are talking a order of magnitude more expensive and thus more irresponsible.

QM, I'm sure you've felt for a while that people have unfairly blamed Bush for a lot of things and attacked him for trivial things, and in many cases you are right. Of course, in many cases you are wrong. And if it has really bothered you that much, then perhaps you should be the better person and not engage in similar behavior just because a Democrat is in office.

i got it game is good it just needs comunity maps cos the valve maps r boring after playing through them once the director is not realy noticable and u have to play the game on the hardest seting to get real enjoyment/ chalenge. but then regardless of how how well you work together it just seems random when you die.

so basicly to make the game fun we just need funky custom maps. prefrabaly large maps where u can palce exsplosives and what not alowign you to buld defencive positoins.

its the comunity maps that made dod and cs what thay are (aside from the base mechanics bing good) , basicly the realy good maps stick around and the shit ones die, when u play css and dods u only realy see maps that have stood over the years. having sead that i dont get why some of the amazing maps from origonal dod still rnt in the game. bahh