Are you really that ignorant? (That’s a rhetorical question, I know you are)
1) watch Argo. There were multiple attempted rescues, starting within days of the revolution.
2) read about Reagan who made a secret, illegal deal with the terroristic Iranians to not release the hostages until after the election to hurt Carter’s chances, then he later sold them weapons in another illegal deal to pay for another secret illegal war with the Contras. If a Democrat did anything near that, he/she would be (rightly) shot as a traitor if not legally then by some nut job….when Cons do it the anti American crimes are ignored and cons celebrate the treason.
3) Also read about the year+ of negotiations by Carter that actually gained their freedom on Jan 20 81. Would have been much sooner without Republican interference. Carter was the one who initially “held” (seized) those $8 billion of Iranian funds, and stopped buying Iranian oil costing them billions more…all legally, unlike the sneaky, illegal, back room collusion with and payoffs to the terrorists Reagan tried, knowingly and intentionally extending the hostage crisis for his personal political gains. The “deal” wasn’t struck on Jan 20…the Iranians delayed the release at Reagan’s request in exchange for promises of special treatment from president Reagan.

Like Biden, Carter actually solved a problem created largely by Republicans despite Republicans doing their utmost to work against America. Gas prices dropped nearly 10% in the last month and continue to drop despite a massive shortage world wide thanks to Russia and Saudi Arabia. Republicans have fought against every effort to lower them, voting against all mitigation efforts in a unified “fuck your gas prices” block.
They even voted against a bill to force oil companies to stop price gouging because it would have dropped prices significantly the day it passed, also helping inflation significantly, and cons REALLY don’t want prices to drop under Biden, certainly not before November.
It’s just like when every Con just voted to protect and keep neo-Nazis, white supremacists, and violent extremists in the military and federal police forces because they don’t want their voters to lose their jobs. Keeping their power is far more important to them than helping the country, and their main methodology is to try to hurt the country then blame the president….odd since they excused the former president from any and all responsibility for his lack of leadership and absolute horrific disaster that was his last year in office, from 1 million dead to -3.5% GDP to millions unemployed to rising inflation to supply chain failures to disastrously ruining the reputation of our elections to dividing the country horrifically to actually trying to overthrow the elected government by force…all for his own personal gain….and you whine that Biden hasn’t fixed everything yet!?

Pretty dishonest for Republicans to do everything in their power to stop any attempted plans on inflation, gas prices, or hostile foreign powers, then blame the president they blocked from fixing the issues they caused. It’s not weak leadership, it’s an anti American party with veto power and a chip on their shoulders willing to hurt the entire nation rather than let Biden (and America) have a “win”.

Now…how did Trump handle it when foreign powers kidnapped and dismembered an American? He covered it up, made excuses, declared the Saudi prince innocent (and Trump was recorded laughing about how he “saved his ass” over that murder)….then his son in law was given a $2 billion payment for future services his company was completely incapable of supplying.

So let’s measure Trump….
Nice guy, no. Moral, no. Ethical, no. Honest, no. Smart, no. Loyal, no. Trustworthy, no.
Fickle to the utmost, yes. Weak leader, yes. Treasonous, yes. Dictatorial, yes. Narcissistic, yes. Criminal, yes. Anti-democracy, yes.
Most American deaths-yes. Worst unemployment, yes. Worst economy, yes. Most domestic terrorism, yes.
Worst president ever by far….unequivocally by every measure. He actually made idiotic GW look benign by comparison.

Your video, Psychedelic Fretless Funk Rock Bass with Delay, has made it into the Top 15 New Videos listing. Congratulations on your achievement. For your contribution you have been awarded 1 Power Point.

If that’s your position I wont bother reading past sentence one.

It’s exactly the same as your other mistake, claiming a billion in goods delayed in transport is the same as a billion dollar loss.

Money not spent is not the same as money lost. It’s actual money lost vs potential expenditure delayed. It’s permanent actual jobs lost vs potential temporary construction delayed (the project as planned is cancelled, not the plan to build a pipeline SOMEWHERE, and spend a billion on it, just not through reservations and sensitive watersheds on the cheap.)

The auto manufacturers will never recoup the lost production, the oil company will build a pipeline. There are costs to delays/redesign, absolutely, but they aren’t 100% of the projected project costs or anywhere close.

Have a nice day. I’ve grown tired of the merry go round. I’m pretty sure we understand each other’s positions, and don’t see progress beyond that. You insist on not seeing similarities and differences I think are incontrovertible….like the idea that a blockade of a major city, closing it down for weeks +, is far more unacceptable and inconveniences exponentially more people and business than a blockade of a railroad out in the country, or of a pipeline on tribal land by the tribe.

I read it, nowhere did it give an estimate of what those protests cost, and it indicated there were multiple other routes for the oil to travel so didn’t even disrupt oil transportation completely, much less ALL commerce.
And it was about pipelines crossing their (or protected) land it seems, a far cry from the truckers. Yes, the validity and severity of your cause matters, just like the damage you do and to whom.

Billions worth of goods stuck temporarily…but no actual estimated cost for their delay, this cost billions in lost production and salaries that won’t be recovered.

That protest was targeted against the offending entity, not the populace. I have no issue with natives blockading their own land and preserves that feed those reservations against permanent destruction for some private profits. That’s a far cry from the truckers blockading the main border crossing for industry and tourism because they’re afraid to get a poke.

The numbers I saw were special. Hundreds of millions-billions lost (your billions in goods delayed doesn’t have a price tag). That was before the bridge was reopened. These protesters weren’t satisfied with that damage and continued to close your capitol with ever shifting demands. Since regular measures had failed, I support emergency measures, seizure, even forfeiture after trial, of any funds or tools used.

Perhaps they became only as localized (but certainly not as targeted, and localized in a city not the unpopulated country), but they had already done exponentially more damage and showed no sign of end or even demands.

Let’s ignore someone personally supporting a grass roots movement outside their country and control, please. I find it a red herring totally unconnected to how he governs.

Yes, some Floyd protests were more violent than the truckers, some weren’t, remember how they were all violently smashed, tear gassed, rubber bullets galore, run through with police trucks, unmarked vans pulling up and grabbing people crossing the streets, unmarked vans driving through towns full of police shooting tear gas at any moving body, etc? Don’t pretend the response is similar.
Also, the Floyd protests lasted a weekend in most cases (occupy Portland really wasn’t about Floyd) and went elsewhere the next march. They weren’t closing down one area for weeks intent on staying. Most lasted hours and were peaceful until police became violent, despite right wing media’s fear-mongering.

I think you’re stretching, putting on blinders, and doing insane mental gymnastics to pretend you believe that. From the actual damage caused, the idiotic reasoning behind it (quickly abandoned), the extremely uncanadianness of the self centered far right rally masquerading as protest, the international damage, the foreign involvement from planning to funding, these are unique “protests” in numerous ways.

Their idiotic beliefs are only one of many distinctions I’ve pointed out, and as I mentioned only color public opinion and the amount of patience they’re given by the public, not how the government treats them. It’s not at all honest for you to pretend that’s the entirety of my position…it’s very Bob of you, and has lost some of my respect.

Pipelines crossing sovereign territory or preserves = bad so blockading those areas to force pipeline movement = good….oil companies didn’t truck the oil out, they increased shipments from other areas by rail. Read the article you linked.

Native cultures and governments are different. Pretending an elected board for a reservation works for the people is naive in the extreme. Read about politics on reservations, who funds the people that get elected in most cases, what happens to opposing candidates…saying the board signed off while so many showed up to fight against it seems a bit at odds, no? Like maybe the board members were bribed, had ties with the oil industry, or other conflicts….just maybe?

And again, those protests didn’t cost a fraction what the truckers did from my research. Delaying delivery of a billion in goods isn’t the same as costing a billion in losses. Neither is delaying or cancelling a billion dollar project. Be adult please….don’t make such specious arguments ….please. They don’t slip by, and they make me think you are being disingenuous.

Economic disruption of the blockades was similar to the Mohawk blockade of railways about 2 years ago:
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-ottawa-rejects-police-intervention-to-put-an-end-to-blockades/

Similarly, mass lay offs and multi-billions of dollars of goods stuck sitting around waiting to get to the industries needing them.

Since at least 2012 the attempted expansion of an existing pipeline(Trans Mountain) was targeted continuously by blockades. Opposition and resulting delays leading to cost overruns so large that company ultimately halted the multi-billion dollar project.

In terms of dollars being lost, the convoy protest wasn't special. More over, the blockade of the border in Ontario that was causing the real economic damage was dismantled and removed before the 'emergency measures' were enacted. Which is to state, the emergency measures were primarily intended to clear out downtown Ottawa. In downtown Ottawa though, the damages were at minimum as localized as any of the lumber or pipeline blockades mentioned.


Prime Minister Trudeau couldn't be more unequivocal when he was expressing his support for the farmer protests in India and the Floyd protests in the US. Clip if you'd like: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B9EaSF6Y0eE

The protests in India absolutely did immensely more harm to India's economy than the convoy here did in Canada. The protests in support of Floyd were again unequivocally more violent than the convoy in Canada.

There really is no basis by which to point to the convoy's actions and find them in any way unique or distinct from multiple other protests within Canada, or ones abroad that have been either given more latitude, or outright embraced and supported.

The distinction as even you can't resist going after, is that their beliefs they are protesting for are stupid and wrong, so no right to protest for them. That isn't how the right to protest within a democracy should be allowed to work.

I also have to point out the 'ethical' argument isn't as cut and dry as you want to make it out either.
-Pipelines bad so blockading is good ignores the fact the same oil gets pumped regardless, it just gets loaded into trucks that burn even more oil to haul it and have a fair greater risk of accidents and spills.
-Defending the rights and lands of Aboriginal peoples(like at Coastal Gas Link site violently attacked with millions in damages while the convoy was being vilified for 'incitement') is anything but obvious. The Wet'suwet'en hereditary leaders made claim to parts of the pipeline route and demanded it be shut down. However, the same Wet'suwet'en people's multiple elected Band Councils signed on with their wishes to proceed with the project. In fact, ALL elected representatives of ALL the Bands with land along the route had ALL signed onto the project and wanting it to proceed. It is in no way obvious that ignoring the will of those other bands to favour the conflicting claims of the hereditary leaders is clearly the most respectful of the people's wishes.

@newtboy,

I agree with more of what you say than you make out. You need to appreciate how different Canada is from the US, particularly in power balance within government and corresponding police action and media coverage.

Long delays in stopping illegal blockade and protest activity is the norm.
-Fairy Creek blockades persisted almost 12 months before police took action
-Blockade of Coastal Link pipepline went on for months before police intervened to allow work to continue.
-Mohawk solidarity blockade of railways in Ontario persisted multiple weeks

The difference to the protests today, the Liberal government was tripping over themselves to reach out to those protest groups, while immediately spitting in the faces of this one.

I've always been of the opinion illegally blocking a roadway, border or business should lead to arrests within the time it takes to notify and send police.

The problem here from a Canadian eye, is that the only time current government is interested in bringing a hammer down is based not upon the actions of protestors, but instead based upon their professed cause.

I refuse to accept tying the right to protest to what cause is being rallied to.

21 cases of tampering with evidence in 6 months, theft, armed robbery, felony possession of controlled substances, felony driving under the influence of a controlled substance, lying on an official report, abuse of power, and intoxication on duty by a police officer and he got two years probation? After his force tried to hide what happened, delay, mitigate, minimize, etc.

In Texas, he should be getting life in prison for the marijuana alone and every penny he or his family has should go to repaying the hundreds of people he illegally arrested, including his pension….his department on the hook for the rest.

*promote exposing exactly who the absolute best in law enforcement really are. A rock star, dedicated, decorated super cop….their golden boy….more of a criminal than everyone he ever arrested combined. Typical.

Where are the good apples. I’ve never seen one. Just a few bad apples, and a few more, couple more, one more bushels, a few trucks full, and 17 train loads, and 4 super size cargo ships full…not a good one to be found in the bunch.

IMO they will raise rates. the economy will stall. they will be forced to increase purchases of equities and reduce rates (again). the fed will not let another 2008 happen however they will make the crash that much harder. the house of cards has been built for a long time over many administrations and its waay past the point of any attempt at recovery. delaying the pain will make the pain even worse but when it comes crashing down USD will be gone forever and alternatives (like metals and yes BTC) will reign. you will have time though as petrodollar is king at this point other nations will fall before us. make your time.

Uh oh. Now the bank and tax fraud surrounding the Trumps acquiring the lease for the DC hotel are under investigation. This time Ivanka is going down with Daddy, because she overvalued properties used to secure the loan bu 3 times, claiming things like her apartment with a for sale price of $8.5 million was worth 25 million, etc.
nothing new, just more Trump fraud, more Trump theft from America, banks, and the public.

This is you pick. This is you guy? Only makes sense if you’re an anti American Russian troll trying to damage America as much as possible.

Edit: D’oh! Pence’s lawyer, present at many meetings in the whitehouse discussing the coup plans, testified for over 9 hours to the Jan 6 commission. He has direct personal knowledge of exactly what the president’s involvement before, during, and after the attack against America for Trump was, and apparently has no qualms about talking about it. He didn’t plead the fifth like all Trump’s lackeys (which Trump says is proof of guilt except when he does it), he didn’t fight subpoenas (which Trump has said is proof of guilt….when it wasn’t him). He testified, with members coming out of the session calling him a patriot who cares about America, unlike many others they’ve subpoenaed and interrogated. A man who put country before a person. Not good for Tangerine Palpatine.

Delay tactics are failing, obstruction is failing, destruction of evidence is failing, hiding the forging of fraudulent certifications for fraudulent electors failed, hiding and denying direct Republican Party involvement has failed, denying individual involvement has failed, denial of the event has failed, abusing expired privileges to hide evidence has failed, whining and crying like spoiled children has failed, threatening prosecutors has failed. Whole lotta fail going on over there.

Big surprise…the Trump campaign was directly behind the plot to create fake slates of electors committed to Trump from multiple states that Biden won, helped prepare and submit fraudulent certification documents, and they hoped to have them counted by Pence instead of the real electors certified by the states for Biden…Giuliani even wrote Pence a letter telling him to do just that. The campaign, led personally by Giuliani, organized this fraud, this subversion of democracy.
More direct Trump election fraud. You really think he’s interested in election security when he’s the one caught red handed committing election fraud on every front? Lol.

Edit: Trump’s communications on and about Jan 6 are now released, soon to be public record. No more delays possible, he took it all the way to the Supreme Court and failed all the way at trying to hide what he did. Better start stretching, you’re going to have some Olympic level mental gymnastics to do soon.

Your party is admitting treason again.
Peter Navarro Had to brag on Bannon’s show that there was a plan, with 100 Republican legislators on board, to obstruct and delay the vote count (a treasonous felony) long enough that terroristic Republican pressure would convince Pence to invalidate multiple states’ electors, send them home, and request that the Republican led legislatures in those cherry picked states discard the vote and hand all electoral votes to Trump despite his losing the election in those states.
That’s treason…subversion of the electoral process, something they’ve been denying for over a year now, but can’t help but brag about in interviews.
At least 3 coup attempts that failed now, and likely many more hidden in Trump’s communications around Jan 6….that’s why he’s so terrified they’ll become public.

Do convicted traitors lose their secret service detail? How about convicted felons in prison? Hope so. I can’t wait to hear Trump hung himself while under suicide watch….happens all the time, right? Happened to his best friend and pedophile partner, prepubescent pussy poking Epstein.

Mea culpa.
>$4.5 trillion last year alone, and Trump’s insistence that he could spend as much as he liked and just print more for 4 years guarantees high inflation as long as the economy grows…there was a delay thanks to the 2020 economic stagnation but we’re seeing the effects now.

Sounds like there was no appeal, Trump’s insurrection records due to be released tomorrow. Courts are closed today, so there’s no chance of another frivolous delay. Get ready to have Trump’s treason shoved in your face for the next few years, if not forever. You know what’s in there is just horrific. That’s why he’s fighting tooth and nail to hide his unofficial personal/campaign actions surrounding his failed coup attempt.

Edit: nope, today he begged for a stay from the (closed) appellate court. It’s possible they’ll grant one, but unlikely since he has no new argument, and it’s settled law that he doesn’t have any right to claim executive privilege because he’s not the executive. At midnight in DC, the point is moot, don’t be surprised if the documents are handed over by 12:01 am.

Loss after loss after loss. Not a good time to be a Trumpzi. (Trumpist Nazi). I’m thinking he might be regretting reinstating the firing squad. On the plus side, he’s going to get the best ratings of his life if they televise it.

I don't know, but there's a few things that concern me:

1. Underestimating your advisory. We did this with Japan in the lead up to WW2. Great powers always fight the last war they won. In our case, that's WW2. China learned from the war they lost as well: WW2, and they're not going to make the same mistakes twice.

2. Ambiguous defense posture. This is how England got dragged into WW1 due to an uncertain position if Germany invaded France. Germany gambled that England wouldn't get involved because it had no spoken mutual defense agreement with France. Had the defense pact been made readily clear, it's possible Germany wouldn't have invaded.

2. Use it or lose it weapons. In WW1, one of the main issues with the initial invasion was train schedules. Things had to go perfectly to get men and material to the front line and any hiccup could delay a military victory. Once the very first German troop train left the station, there was no way to stop the invasion. Now we've got a situation where a war over Taiwan would be won or lost in about an hour of the first shot. China knows that should the US get involved, China's military assets are going to be blown up and fast. This puts China in a situation where they might choose the launch everything in a maximum impact first strike. Faced with overwhelming damage, the US would be forced to make some hard choices about how to respond. Would it go nuclear? It's according to how much Taiwan means to us.

"It won't happen". Go to Europe and see how many tombstones bear that inscription.

I'd say 50/50.

Oh shit! The congressional house oversight and reform committee has found that Trump committed massive bank frauds during his presidency, before, and after.

He hid his massive debts when bidding on the lease for the old post office and getting loans to buy it….preferential loans from foreign banks based on blatantly fraudulent claims about his net worth. That’s bank fraud.
He reported profits of $150 million (publicly he claimed more), but in reality had losses of $75 million. He reported one huge value for his properties on loan applications and another, exponentially smaller, likely sometimes negative value on tax forms. That’s bank and tax fraud.
He took in over $3.7 million from foreign governments for rooms that were rarely if ever occupied. That’s a flagrant violation of the Emoluments clause, Article I, Section 9, Clause 8 of the United States Constitution.

No charges filed by congress yet, but expect all this information and accompanying documentation to make it to the prosecutors in New York who ARE charging him with bank fraud, tax fraud, charity fraud, embezzlement, and who knows what else.

Not a good time to be a Trump.

Just a little PS: In a deposition that took place in August, Rudy Giuliani admitted that the "evidence" he based his voter fraud conspiracy on actually came from posts on Facebook. Believe it or not, this man used to be considered a brilliant legal mind, but now he's been reduced to filing lawsuits based off idiotic conspiracy theories he saw while scrolling through social media.…and you listened to him.
🤦‍♂️

Edit: ruh roe, sounds like there are multiple takes of Trump’s message to the rioters where he praised them but refused to tell them to stop the attack or leave the capitol. Part of the lengthy delay in his statement was because he had to re-record it repeatedly before they finally got him to tell his people to leave. Of course, seeing the takes where he just praised the attacking terrorist mob won’t change your mind, but they will inform future history about when America had a super villain as president.