so many components to this video. Trance's arguments may be worthless, but the video itself is great.

you have the class aspect. Here we are shown this nice upper class home of a hardworking man (which alone opens up the sub-argument of whether or not he really does work hard or does he just reap the benefits of his employees' work,) and we're supposed to feel bad because the police confiscated their house over something relatively trivial. Would you care if it was a lower class home? middle class? or would you just assume the lower class family are probably guilty and deserve it?

Then you got the whole war on drugs component, which is even more nuanced because heroin is a nasty drug which I would agree should remain illegal. But then weigh that against the idea that it was a trivial amount of heroin. Would you feel bad for the family if the son wasn't small time and had a couple grand worth in the house? how about a 100 grand? a million?

All completely separate from the police abuse and corruption issue that's already been discussed. This video is crazy dense with issues that need to be addressed

Trancecoach gonna Trance.

nice find trance.
*promote

I think your efforts are commendable, but doomed to fail. Trance is not interested in learning, and when you teach him something he can't find a crazed, wrong link to discount your knowledge with, he'll simply ignore it and move on to more and more infantile argument. He recently became my second ignore.
I am glad you called him out on his doctorate in underwater basket weaving, unfortunately for us all it does not help him understand science in the least, or the scientific method, but somehow convinces him that it does.
EDIT: Oh, "doctorate in Social 'science'", which he must mistakenly believe is a true science and not a misnomer.
I see he continues with his intentional miss-reading and/or miss-quoting, claiming you said purely consensus is the ONLY way science progresses, not that it's the way that progression is accepted by the scientific community. Me thinks this miss-understanding is an intentional miss-statement in order to continue his 'debate' by constantly changing either his own, or your stance on the subject.
I also noted the passive aggressive (and terrible English) statement " the manner in which I posted the links may not have been "fair," ", to me implying you just couldn't assimilate that much information, not conceding that it was all an attempt at an overwhelming avalanche of BS propaganda.
Kudos on your reasoned, patient approach. I ran out of patience with the kindergarten argument style and quit him.

@Trancecoach

interesting how i use a line i see in your commentary quite often :
"let me know how that works out for ya?"

i was being a cheeky shit,ill grant ya that but to think i was picking a fight?
that dips into delusional land.

ya know trance,
when people point out that you may be coming across as an arrogant ass,most people respond with an apology,but not you!

and @ChaosEngine pointed out the flaw in your logic,just as i have and so many others.
humans are irrational and economics is a human based system.

/drops mic

pick a fight?....seriously?
some people...

*backup and replaced with a video that wasn't auto play. Thought that was best for the sift and sifters. Hope you're cool with that Trance.

Ya know what, @Trancecoach is right. I could rebut all your points, but you've taken an ideological position that is unsupported by evidence, so clearly this is a waste of my time.

You probably genuinely believe what you've written, despite it being obvious nonsense.

One thing I can't let slide is your last little fantasy about the lone scientist against the establishment. That hasn't been true for a long time, and even then, it was generally religion or business (cf. Edison and Tesla) and not scientific consensus that impeded progress. Most major advances in science have come about by people working together, sharing results and bouncing ideas off each other. In fact, most of the time, the people we credit with great ideas (Newton, Einstein, etc) were only a step ahead of other scientists working toward the same ideas.

Yes, evidence trumps consensus, but scientists are not idiots, and there isn't some lone genius who has understood climate change when everyone else hasn't. If there was, the scientific community would recognise it.

There simply isn't any evidence to support your position that isn't easily dismissed in a few paragraphs. Read http://skepticalscience.com

The whole climate change denial (and no, I won't dignify it by calling it scepticism, that's an insult to scepticism) is marketing.

So I'll leave you, trance and the republicans in your little fantasy world where scientists and environmental campaigners have engaged in a massively profitable (please explain how, still not clear on this one) scheme to fuck up the world economy (because??? reasons, I guess) and the heroic oil companies are going to rescue us from a fate worse than a clean planet.

Meanwhile, I, the scientific community and the other humans that don't believe the earth is flat will accept the reality of climate change and move on.

Stop. Feeding. The. Troll. He has pointed out that he isn't interested in actual science just giving a voice to those that deny the science. Otherwise he would be asking legitimate question, instead of his straw man of asking us if we've stopped buying plastic, or if we're vegetarians.

Trance is not making sense because he is bored and wants to argue. He's good at talking and finding things which he can then talk more and more about. At this point however he is trolling, he is not adding to the discussion he is either ballbusting or shaming.

This is supposed to be a community of discussion on Videos that we sift. Instead it's a lot of people allowing someone to waste their time and yours. Stop feeding the troll, just ignore him.

You mean the one where trance cock falsely accused me of ad hom? Yeah, what a cunt I am...

@Jinx that's the point. it's a complex issue.

Copyright should encourage creativity and does, but as I said it's been perverted.

The end point is that ultimately creators must get paid somehow, and taking a simpleton approach like trance moron gets us nowhere.

Happy Birthday Trance!

Trancecoach is arguing with himself and doesn't seem to realize it.

In one breath, he rightly states that the Civil War wasn't about ending slavery, but perserving the union. Then in the next breath asks why Lincoln didn't avoid the war by purchasing all the slaves.

Hey Trance, do you even realize how contradictory you are?

White Libertarian bullshit Trance.

....got so booglerized from reading the back 'n forth between newt 'n trance that I slipped into a newttransmittance er summpthin'...I now side with your particular take on your own delusional ramblings Velocity, carry-on please

political and economic structures in complex societies is so...massive..that i tend to get lost in attempting to convey my point.

how do i tell trance that what he is actually suggesting is corporate tyranny?

how do you tell someone that and have them listen,when my examples are so weak and ineffectual.

ya know what..im gonna post a chomsky interview that covers much of our discussion.

hope people watch it because american libertarianism has a dark secret,and its abject slavery.

unless those libertarians know of some new democratic corporation that we heard of..never.