>> ^Drax:
Fusionaut, they actually address your arguments in one of their videos. They claim to take the ten commandments literally, and say all the new texts that offer easy repentance are bogus. That you're only repenting to a fellow man, not the Big-G himself.
Kirk continues to be a growing pain.


You are so right, he is a pain that is grow... HEY WAIT I SEE WHAT YOU DID THERE!!!


These guys have their heads so far up each others asses it makes me queasy. Why can't only people like Ray and Kirk die every day? I know that sounds messed up, but they'll go to heaven and get blown by angels for infinity so who cares.

Let's spend all our time on earth trying to make sure the time after is perfect. What a selfish outlook.

I really wish I knew what causes people to think this way. Is it really skewed logic + vivid imagination = fundamentalism, or is it something deeper?

only a very small part of Christianity attempts to teach people to get along with each other. The rest of it is doctrine set up to encourage obedience to centralized power. This is all terribly ironic, since in the small portion of the bible actually dedicated to the teachings of jesus it presents the notion that because of jesus, anyone and everyone can have a direct connection to the magical abusive drunken old guy in the sky. Jesus spent much of his teachings tearing down the notion of centralized authority, and controlled access to spirituality.

Christianity became the political tool that we see today back in 325 when Roman Emperor Constantine paid a bunch of religious leaders to vote on which documents were representative of Christian faith - as long as they left room for the Emperor to be part of that power structure. It's much easier to control the people if they all worship the same god, instead of having multiple gods all with different agendas.

There's this small little bit of good stuff in the bible which is a decent chunk of what jesus says. The rest is filled with genealogies, tales of war, killings, an angry god, and Paul of tarsus, calling on the newly enlightened Christians to maintain the oppressive and intolerant orders of the old testament. All of that contrary to what jesus claimed was the entire purpose of his time on earth. Jesus talked about how his purpose was to do away with all of those old laws, and to create a new method of gaining favor with his dad (who is also somehow himself).

The bible itself is so clouded with mountains of useless if not dangerous and contrary garbage that people use to justify their own hatred. If the bible really was there to create a moral compass for people, it would be much, much shorter and clearer. It is quite possibly the most poorly written instruction manual ever created, and I've read some really terrible Engrish manuals before.

There are 1189 chapters in the bible. Does it really take 789,626 words to say "don't be a dick"? you'd think that the creator of the universe would make better use of text, and possibly reveal some genuinely useful information, like the nature of viruses and bacteria, techniques for better agriculture, methods of international diplomacy that don't involve "shoot first, ask questions later", or even something as basic as "slavery is bad".

The point is that the words on the page were scientific based facts.

Noooooo - the only scientific evidence is that Earth has climate cycles of warming and cooling and that the Earth is currently in a warming cycle. There is no 'scientific evidence' that human activity is causing any of that cycle to take place either positively or negatively. There is more C02 in the atmosphere, but there is no evidence that the C02 is what 'caused' the warming. There is compelling evidence that C02 is an aftereffect of the cycle, not an indicator of it. And historically, there have been periods of time in earth's history when there was far more C02 in the atmosphere. It did not cause 'harm'. The periods of more C02 and warmth have been times when the Earth was the most lush and had the greatest biodiversity. There is no evidence that human C02 emissions have caused the current warm blip. All that exists is inference, and vague correlations which any statistician would call either negligible or non-existent. The AMG movement is political - not scientific - but they need scientists to hype the masses so they pay them massive amounts of money to ignore evidence, make hasty generalizations, and sensational claims. Follow the money, man. Follow the money. This is one of the biggest scams in all of History since indulgences.

With Obama's encouragement of education and sciences, along with SSD technology and exponentially better and cheaper tech... the manipulation of data by the dishonest will come to an end.

It's so simple! SSD technology will change human nature!

Look, I admire your moxie and energy, kid. More commentary later. Oh, also, YOUR ARE ALL FOOLS! ONLY EYE HAVE THE POWER OF SOLUTIONS STRAIGHT FROM THE SOURCE!

EARTH HAS 4 CORNER
SIMULTANEOUS 4-DAY
TIME CUBE
IN ONLY 24 HOUR ROTATION.
4 Corner TIME, CUBES EARTH...

SATAN is causing climate change. HE is making things REALLY HOT because people aren't praying to God enough. As a result, he is gaining in power. So if people don't REPENT to JEEESUS, the we most certainly will be in for a HOT and HELLISH time on Earth for sure!

MAGIC IS REAL. Demons are REAL. Jesus is REAL.

LOL. Yeah. That is what she thinks.

>> ^Irishman:
So rather than set a timeline, they have made time non-linear, they are fucking GENIUSES. With this technology they could solve the world's energy problems in about ten minutes. That's MINUS ten minutes to you people still working with linear time.

Finally Gene Ray is getting the recognition he deserves. Four Corner Time, Cubes Earth!

You can't be atheist AND agnostic. That's just downright silly. I say this in the kindliest way possible.

But, seriously, Ace, I like you. You give me a good challenge. I was delighted to see that you lost your faith because of the age-old "problem of evil," which is the name for the whole hell+justgod=wtf? phenomenon you described. I wrote a ridiculously long paper on JUST THAT TOPIC about a year ago. Did you know that Mormon theology actually solves that problem? This is what got me so into that book, Mormon Doctrine. I'M NOT EVEN KIDDING. It's crazy! I can send you my paper sometime if you want.

The dilemna is:

1. All-good
2. All-powerful
3. Evil exists

Does that look familiar? Man, I love this stuff. I don't want to convert you or anything, I just find it incredibly interesting to talk about. We should chat.

In reply to this comment by theaceofclubz:
I left this response recently on pinky's page in response to her critique on http://www.videosift.com/video/What-Mormon-Theology-Is-Really-All-About-1975 and thought it was applicable to the thread so I am pasting it.

"After watching the video it was my intention to write a scathing refutation of the blasphemy. However, after doing a little web searching I found the facts weren't going to support me. First the only glaring inaccuracies I found in the video were:

Mormons don't believe that physical sex took place between Mary and Heavenly Father. Jesus was definitely the son of the father and impregnation occurred somehow but the Mary is a virgin thing is still in effect so I think it rules out a physical union. I'm not completely 100% on this though, so I'm going to ask my mom tomorrow.

The quote at the end by Joe is almost certainly fake, but I have no proof of this and may be wrong.

On the more shocking theology that isn't necessarily broached in Sunday School:

Elohim - Yup, thats Gods name. It also refers to the belief in multiple gods that aren't worshiped or thought to have any relevance in earth life. see
http://www.mormonwiki.com/Elohim
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elohim#Elohim_in_the_Latter_Day_Saint_movement

Kolob - Yes, there is literally a freakin' star in the universe that you could literally point to and say "thats where god lives." (Heavens Gate creepy) Its exact location is disputed and not addressed by church authorities, try a search for "Kolob constellation"
http://www.mormonwiki.org/Kolob
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kolob#Literal_reading
http://lds.about.com/library/bl/faq/blkolob.htm

Celestial Polygamy - It was my understanding when in the faith that Polygamy was a celestial practice that had be suspended during our time on earth due to prophetic revelation, and that when you do get in heaven men can marry multiple wives, but women can only marry one man. The whole prophetic revelation occurring at the same point in history that the US government made the ultimatum that Mormons had to give up polygamy before they would receive statehood is just seen as a coincidence. (seriously) After searching a little though a guess there is a little dispute over it.
http://www.mormonwiki.org/Celestial_polygamy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celestial_marriage

I'd say that anything not outlined in this message is about 95% accurate, and certainly presented in the most sensationalist fashion.
I wasn't aware of most of this theological stuff while in the church and can understand when Mormons claim its inaccurate. However, if you believe church doctrine to be true then you sort of carry the theology indirectly."

My response to this is/was:

Come back to me with this argument when you've found better sources. A lesson about church doctrine: You cannot believe that Mormons believe it unless you get it straight from the source. That is, it has to come from canonized scripture, church lesson manuals, or at least General Conference talks from the 12 apostles or the prophet. Someone with authority has to have declared that it is doctrine in order to claim that it is doctrine. Okaybee? Wiki does not count. I'm not talking history here. History can be filtered by the church and you can't neccesarily get all of the information from their sources. But doctrine, yes. BECAUSE IT IS ONLY DOCTRINE IF THEY SAY IT IS DOCTRINE, NOT IF YOU SAY IT IS DOCTRINE! Why don't people understand this about religion? Catholics are often the victims of this, too. You can site as many sources as you want, but it isn't church doctrine unless it is official church doctrine. I can't stress this enough. And I have a feeling some people will still fail to understand it.

>> ^theaceofclubz:
I left this response recently on pinky's page in response to her critique on http://www.videosift.com/video/What-Mormon-Theology-Is-Really-All-About-1975 and thought it was applicable to the thread so I am pasting it.
"After watching the video it was my intention to write a scathing refutation of the blasphemy. However, after doing a little web searching I found the facts weren't going to support me. First the only glaring inaccuracies I found in the video were:
Mormons don't believe that physical sex took place between Mary and Heavenly Father. Jesus was definitely the son of the father and impregnation occurred somehow but the Mary is a virgin thing is still in effect so I think it rules out a physical union. I'm not completely 100% on this though, so I'm going to ask my mom tomorrow.
The quote at the end by Joe is almost certainly fake, but I have no proof of this and may be wrong.
On the more shocking theology that isn't necessarily broached in Sunday School:
Elohim - Yup, thats Gods name. It also refers to the belief in multiple gods that aren't worshiped or thought to have any relevance in earth life. see
http://www.mormonwiki.com/Elohim
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elohim#Elohim_in_the_Latter_Day_Saint_movement
Kolob - Yes, there is literally a freakin' star in the universe that you could literally point to and say "thats where god lives." (Heavens Gate creepy) Its exact location is disputed and not addressed by church authorities, try a search for "Kolob constellation"
http://www.mormonwiki.org/Kolob
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kolob#Literal_reading
http://lds.about.com/library/bl/faq/blkolob.htm
Celestial Polygamy - It was my understanding when in the faith that Polygamy was a celestial practice that had be suspended during our time on earth due to prophetic revelation, and that when you do get in heaven men can marry multiple wives, but women can only marry one man. The whole prophetic revelation occurring at the same point in history that the US government made the ultimatum that Mormons had to give up polygamy before they would receive statehood is just seen as a coincidence. (seriously) After searching a little though a guess there is a little dispute over it.
http://www.mormonwiki.org/Celestial_polygamy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celestial_marriage
I'd say that anything not outlined in this message is about 95% accurate, and certainly presented in the most sensationalist fashion.
I wasn't aware of most of this theological stuff while in the church and can understand when Mormons claim its inaccurate. However, if you believe church doctrine to be true then you sort of carry the theology indirectly."

Come back to me with this argument when you've found better sources. A lesson about church doctrine: You cannot believe that Mormons believe it unless you get it straight from the source. That is, it has to come from canonized scripture, church lesson manuals, or at least General Conference talks from the 12 apostles or the prophet. Someone with authority has to have declared that it is doctrine in order to claim that it is doctrine. Okaybee? Wiki does not count.

In reply to this comment by theaceofclubz:
After watching the video it was my intention to write a scathing refutation of the blasphemy. However, after doing a little web searching I found the facts weren't going to support me. First the only glaring inaccuracies I found in the video were:

Mormons don't believe that physical sex took place between Mary and Heavenly Father. Jesus was definitely the son of the father and impregnation occurred somehow but the Mary is a virgin thing is still in effect so I think it rules out a physical union. I'm not completely 100% on this though, so I'm going to ask my mom tomorrow.

The quote at the end by Joe is almost certainly fake, but I have no proof of this and may be wrong.

On the more shocking theology that isn't necessarily broached in Sunday School:

Elohim - Yup, thats Gods name. It also refers to the belief in multiple gods that aren't worshiped or thought to have any relevance in earth life. see
http://www.mormonwiki.com/Elohim
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elohim#Elohim_in_the_Latter_Day_Saint_movement

Kolob - Yes, there is literally a freakin' star in the universe that you could literally point to and say "thats where god lives." (Heavens Gate creepy) Its exact location is disputed and not addressed by church authorities, try a search for "Kolob constellation"
http://www.mormonwiki.org/Kolob
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kolob#Literal_reading
http://lds.about.com/library/bl/faq/blkolob.htm

Celestial Polygamy - It was my understanding when in the faith that Polygamy was a celestial practice that had be suspended during our time on earth due to prophetic revelation, and that when you do get in heaven men can marry multiple wives, but women can only marry one man. The whole prophetic revelation occurring at the same point in history that the US government made the ultimatum that Mormons had to give up polygamy before they would receive statehood is just seen as a coincidence. (seriously) After searching a little though a guess there is a little dispute over it.
http://www.mormonwiki.org/Celestial_polygamy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celestial_marriage

I'd say that anything not outlined in this message is about 95% accurate, and certainly presented in the most sensationalist fashion.
I wasn't aware of most of this theological stuff while in the church and can understand when Mormons claim its inaccurate. However, if you believe church doctrine to be true then you sort of carry the theology indirectly.

Keep in mind that this theology rests on top of the church history, which is also more shockingly ridiculous then the general joe on the street has any idea of.


In reply to this comment by thepinky:
Wow. This is extremely inaccurate. I don't even know where to begin. Lies, people. Don't believe a word of it!!!

I left this response recently on pinky's page in response to her critique on http://www.videosift.com/video/What-Mormon-Theology-Is-Really-All-About-1975 and thought it was applicable to the thread so I am pasting it.

"After watching the video it was my intention to write a scathing refutation of the blasphemy. However, after doing a little web searching I found the facts weren't going to support me. First the only glaring inaccuracies I found in the video were:

Mormons don't believe that physical sex took place between Mary and Heavenly Father. Jesus was definitely the son of the father and impregnation occurred somehow but the Mary is a virgin thing is still in effect so I think it rules out a physical union. I'm not completely 100% on this though, so I'm going to ask my mom tomorrow.

The quote at the end by Joe is almost certainly fake, but I have no proof of this and may be wrong.

On the more shocking theology that isn't necessarily broached in Sunday School:

Elohim - Yup, thats Gods name. It also refers to the belief in multiple gods that aren't worshiped or thought to have any relevance in earth life. see
http://www.mormonwiki.com/Elohim
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elohim#Elohim_in_the_Latter_Day_Saint_movement

Kolob - Yes, there is literally a freakin' star in the universe that you could literally point to and say "thats where god lives." (Heavens Gate creepy) Its exact location is disputed and not addressed by church authorities, try a search for "Kolob constellation"
http://www.mormonwiki.org/Kolob
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kolob#Literal_reading
http://lds.about.com/library/bl/faq/blkolob.htm

Celestial Polygamy - It was my understanding when in the faith that Polygamy was a celestial practice that had be suspended during our time on earth due to prophetic revelation, and that when you do get in heaven men can marry multiple wives, but women can only marry one man. The whole prophetic revelation occurring at the same point in history that the US government made the ultimatum that Mormons had to give up polygamy before they would receive statehood is just seen as a coincidence. (seriously) After searching a little though a guess there is a little dispute over it.
http://www.mormonwiki.org/Celestial_polygamy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celestial_marriage

I'd say that anything not outlined in this message is about 95% accurate, and certainly presented in the most sensationalist fashion.
I wasn't aware of most of this theological stuff while in the church and can understand when Mormons claim its inaccurate. However, if you believe church doctrine to be true then you sort of carry the theology indirectly."

After watching the video it was my intention to write a scathing refutation of the blasphemy. However, after doing a little web searching I found the facts weren't going to support me. First the only glaring inaccuracies I found in the video were:

Mormons don't believe that physical sex took place between Mary and Heavenly Father. Jesus was definitely the son of the father and impregnation occurred somehow but the Mary is a virgin thing is still in effect so I think it rules out a physical union. I'm not completely 100% on this though, so I'm going to ask my mom tomorrow.

The quote at the end by Joe is almost certainly fake, but I have no proof of this and may be wrong.

On the more shocking theology that isn't necessarily broached in Sunday School:

Elohim - Yup, thats Gods name. It also refers to the belief in multiple gods that aren't worshiped or thought to have any relevance in earth life. see
http://www.mormonwiki.com/Elohim
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elohim#Elohim_in_the_Latter_Day_Saint_movement

Kolob - Yes, there is literally a freakin' star in the universe that you could literally point to and say "thats where god lives." (Heavens Gate creepy) Its exact location is disputed and not addressed by church authorities, try a search for "Kolob constellation"
http://www.mormonwiki.org/Kolob
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kolob#Literal_reading
http://lds.about.com/library/bl/faq/blkolob.htm

Celestial Polygamy - It was my understanding when in the faith that Polygamy was a celestial practice that had be suspended during our time on earth due to prophetic revelation, and that when you do get in heaven men can marry multiple wives, but women can only marry one man. The whole prophetic revelation occurring at the same point in history that the US government made the ultimatum that Mormons had to give up polygamy before they would receive statehood is just seen as a coincidence. (seriously) After searching a little though a guess there is a little dispute over it.
http://www.mormonwiki.org/Celestial_polygamy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celestial_marriage

I'd say that anything not outlined in this message is about 95% accurate, and certainly presented in the most sensationalist fashion.
I wasn't aware of most of this theological stuff while in the church and can understand when Mormons claim its inaccurate. However, if you believe church doctrine to be true then you sort of carry the theology indirectly.

Keep in mind that this theology rests on top of the church history, which is also more shockingly ridiculous then the general joe on the street has any idea of.


In reply to this comment by thepinky:
Wow. This is extremely inaccurate. I don't even know where to begin. Lies, people. Don't believe a word of it!!!

The first two Superman films are really special.

One thing that always bugs me when people talk about the end of the first Superman. He didn't "turn the earth backwards", he flew so damn fast that he went back in time. The earth appears to turn backwards because the camera is watching Superman move backwards through time. If you were moving backwards in time, things would appear to move backwards. Okay let me repeat myself some more lol.

"This is the Music Video for the first single "She Called Up" from the album "Time On Earth" released 11/17/07"? It was released in September according to YouTube description.

Chicar, to provide one set of answers to your questions:

1) How does one face death with the belief that there is an afterlife? Does it make it OK that you are leaving your mortal self? Your time on Earth is ending regardless of what comes after. How have you spent your time? Have you led a life that you feel proud of? Having the opportunity to reflect upon those questions after death does not make death any easier. Believing that I will spend eternity in God's presence does not offer any more solace than believing that after having spent my life fighting for what I believe is right, I will have the opportunity to rest. Nothingness need not be viewed as fearsome.

2) I don't think I have any question in my life weighing more heavily on my mind. Self-exploration and attempting to discover as much as I can about the natural world and universe around me consume a large portion of my day. Philosophy is a good outlet for secular pursuit of such grand questions.

3) I feel that this question presupposes the existence of God and is too vague to provide a good answer to. But perhaps it is just my interpretation of the question that is vague. I will do my best to answer as succinctly as I can. Having been raised Roman Catholic, I spent a lot of time examining the philosophy of the church, but not in relation to God's will(even when I believed in God). It must be recognized that the church is primarily a social institution, created by man, for man. As such, it cannot accurately reflect the will of God, again presupposing God's existence. It will always reflect the will of man. Holy men's interpretations of God's will is inherently tainted simply as a result of being human.

I could talk for hours on these questions. Discussing spirituality, even as an atheist, brings me great inner peace. The reason I feel frightened by many Christians, particularly in America, these days is that they have politicized their religion. They have removed its spirituality and have taken to using it as justification for their agendas, which are frequently filled with a shocking amount of hate.

A million miles from planet Earth, last weekend the STEREO B spacecraft found itself in the shadow of the Moon. So, looking toward the Sun, extreme ultraviolet cameras onboard STEREO B were able to record a stunning movie of a lunar transit (aka solar eclipse), as the Moon tracked across the solar disk. Each frame of the movie is a false-color composite of images made through four different filters that highlight temperature regimes and structures in the upper solar atmosphere. In this frame, large bright active regions, seen as dark sunspots in visible light, flank the Moon's silhouetted disk. The Moon appears small, less than 1/4th the size seen from Earth, because the spacecraft-Moon separation is over four times the Earth-Moon distance. Tonight, the Moon will find itself in planet Earth's shadow in a total lunar eclipse.