@enoch, I didn't see your response to me since you didn't "reply" to me, or "message me" ("@Trancecoach"), so I'm just seeing this now:

> you argue like someone who has found religion.

What is this, then, if not ad hominem? What has religion got to do with economics in this context? I'm willing to change my mind, if you can show me the flaws in my argument.

> and its not just you that never wants to address the dark side of capitalism.

So, please tell me what didn't get 'addressed?' Did I not respond to every point in your post? Where are your replies to my reply?

> disciples of free market capitalism never want to talk about their deformed child
> locked in the upstairs bedroom.out of sight..out of mind.

Again, what wasn't addressed? Free market capitalists love to talk about free market capitalism. Ok. So are you stuck on this such that you're unable to read/respond to my response?

Seems to me that you're projecting, because while you say that my responses are like a 'sermon,' this portion of your post actually sounds like a sermon:

> every system has its flaws.
> both positive and negative.
> and no system is a rigid single dimension but rather varying layers of slight
> differences.
> this includes every political and economic system thought of or just living in the
> realm of dreams.
> it is through discussion with people we may disagree in which new ideas can breed
> and grow.
> this was my ultimate goal in talking with you.
> instead i get a sermon.
> hope has two daughters.
> anger and courage.
> anger at the way things are,and courage to change them.
> i havent had a beer in ten years.
> gonna go grab me a beer or two.
> what a silly,sad old man i have become.
> old men should stop dreaming.....

Let's not degrade the level of discourse to ad hominem or sob stories. If you need help, ask for help. But don't blame me if you relapse. We are all accountable for our own thoughts, feelings, and behaviors.

> old men should stop dreaming

Dream all you want, but don't expect everyone else to take your dreams seriously just because you say so. (Why not address any of the points I made in my response?)

"The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the
average voter." ~ Winston Churchill

I'm at a loss as to what response I can give you that would 'appease' your sensibilities? As far as I could tell, all of your questions were addressed. But you ignored my reply, and went back to "no one wants to talk about it" or whatever. So, what can be said?

It seems like you don't really want to "debate" or "converse" or whatever. If I refute your arguments, then you interpret that as meaning that I don't want to talk about it. Did I get that right? That doesn't make much sense to me. If not, please explain what I am missing here.

Also, what does it matter if you are old or young, or a dreamer or not, in terms of getting to the truth about socialism and capitalism?

> but you are blinded by dogma.

If so, why not show me what part of my argument is dogmatic or not epistemologically sound?
For example, what specifically about the right to and/or preference for non-aggression is 'dogmatic?' I don't like being bullied, so does that make me dogmatic? What about the impossibility of economic calculation under any sort of socialism is 'dogmatic?' And how so?

If someone doesn't understand calculus, they might call it 'dogma.' But if you understand it, then you can look at the equations and see for yourself if they make mathematical sense (or not). Was Galileo's contention that the Earth orbits the Sun dogmatic? What about the assertion that the Sun orbits the Earth, was that dogmatic? What's the difference?

> it is through discussion with people we may disagree in which new ideas can breed
> and grow. this was my ultimate goal in talking with you.

This is all very nice, but did you bother to find out what my 'ultimate goal' in talking to you was? Or is it all about yours?

Some-but-not-all people get upset when you point out how their beliefs do not correspond to the facts. Socrates was sentenced to commit suicide and Galileo died under house arrest.

I won't say whether or not this is true, or applies in this instance.

> every system has its flaws. both positive and negative. and no system is a rigid
> single dimension but rather varying layers of slight differences. this includes every
> political and economic system thought of or just living in the realm of dreams.

This, in itself is a dogmatic statement.

Look, man. I like you. I appreciate your comments, your earnestness, and willingness to engage our discourse. I also appreciate your respect and appreciation (although I can't say I'm sure how I've earned or deserved it). You've apologized for what seems to me to be ad hominem and I appreciate and accept your apology. I, too, apologize if you seem that I've been terse or avoidant in authentic engagement in dialogue with you. But in keeping with the points and arguments themselves, I think we'll both be much better off in terms of learning and growing and avoiding going off-track or off-topic into commentary about the messenger as opposed to the message.

Your video, The Syrian Conflict in Five Minutes, has made it into the Top 15 New Videos listing. Congratulations on your achievement. For your contribution you have been awarded 1 Power Point.

Yep. Someone started the host. We all had to wait for other players to load their game and join. Even if it take several minutes. I always had to tell people to wait over five minutes BASED ON THEIR CLOCKS (not their heads) since some people were using 386s that took minutes to load DOOM and mods! We couldn't join in real time like the newer games.

I will let you guess on my age.

My take:

Weak music and lyrics, poor directing and editing, and five minutes of credits (?!) all depicting the whitest (and not racist) subculture in the land today.

This is amazing. Harmon, the NSA apologist in the video above, expresses her disgust for being wiretapped under the Bush Administration in this video. Partisan politics. Around the five minute mark:

http://youtu.be/m_CUvZcv-Sw?t=4m51s

Meh. He's like the guy at work who has to get up and change the station on the radio every five minutes.

Just throw an eraser at him.

This guy's channel is dangerously addictive. They're all these sub-five minute videos titled "A point about..." and I can't stop clicking on them. What about scimitars? What about the hoplite cuirass? I HAVE TO KNOW.

Five minutes with Iain Banks has been added as a related post - related requested by RFlagg on that post.

Your video, 2 months on icebreaker in Antarctica (in under five minutes), has made it into the Top 15 New Videos listing. Congratulations on your achievement. For your contribution you have been awarded 1 Power Point.

This women entered the room clearly believing the bullshit from the right that 'NAZI LIBERALS WANT TO FORCEFULLY TAKE YOUR GUNS AWAY!!!!' She got rolled. No need to mention the fact that a women with a gun in her home is more likely to die from that gun than kill an intruder, or that under the proposed laws the woman in her story would still be able to legally own a shotgun.

And that photoshop, lol. Craptastic! looks like it was done by someone with little skill or thrown together in five minutes.

"Hey Chuckie. Got an idea."

"Sup."

"Go get your car and get some cops chasin ya. I'll film it on the TV! Then you bring alla cop cars by the front there and I'll film you live! Then I film the TV again. Bet Charleese'll be some impressed Chuckie."

"Cool. Then what?"

"Then we trades and I drive and you film."

"Cool. I'm gonna get the car now. Don fux this up. Charleese is gonna think this is awesome."

(Five minutes later)

"Now where'd I put my damn phone? Ah here it is. Hello, Charleese's mom? Can I speak with Charleese, please? Hey Charleese. Member how you said you wanna dump Chuckie and go out with me? Yeah well check the news channel. Yeah that's Chuckie all right. Naah I dunno what the hell he was thinkin, but pretty sure he's gonna be somewhere else for a while. Pick you up Sadday at about eight? Cool."

Alex Jones seems to believe every theory that crosses his desk.

He also should be the poster boy for what's happened to discourse in this country at large. Gone are the days when people try and convince each other, now we only try to get the most attention from the side that already agrees with us. A shouting tirade of uninterrupted drivel, and if you shout loud enough, there seems to be no shortage of people willing to put a microphone in front of you.

Oh, and gun rights as a basis to defend yourself from the military is retarded. The military would lay waste to whatever arsenal you've got held up in your compound in Montana. You wouldn't even get a chance to hear the supersonic missile that blasts you and your preparations to smithereens.

In that type of revolutionary scenario, the only hope would be in a fractured military, and none of that would be very pretty.

The sad thing is , Alex Jones occasionally grazes and actual decent point, like about large multinational corporations being beyond national taxes and laws, but it's lost in so much bullshit, who could care to listen to him.

He would do well to focus on something, instead of trying to fit every bullshit crackpot idea someone tried to sell a book on into a five minute conversation.

When I was 10 years old, I played with Star Wars figures. At some point, I lost two of the guns for two of the characters. So I wrote Kenner, the maker of the the Star Wars figures at the time, wondering if there was some way I could get just those two guns.

A few weeks later, I received a padded envelope in the mail. Someone at Kenner had received my letter, gone down to the supply area and hand scooped parts and accessories from the line. Not only did I get the two guns I was missing, but at least 8-10 dupes, 1-2 copies of every other type of gun, replacement plastic capes for Darth Vader, Obi Wan, Bespin Leia, the newer cloth capes, Yoda's plastic snake and walking stick, in-arm lightsabers, hand grip lightsabers, you name it, it was in that padded envelope - including stuff for figures I didn't even own.

Someone took five minutes out of their day and it made my year. I've never forgotten that lesson.

Well, I am going to have to take a break from the Sift until this contrast issue is resolved. Which I hope is in the plans (I know you are getting lots of bug reports, much more important than this.)

It has gotten to the point that I come to the Sift and I have a headache within five minutes of straining to read. And I haven't even been here all that much -- I've been conditioned, I guess, over the past four days.

Grey on gray (and green). I'm dying here. (Why not black letters? Why the gray letters? I don't understand.... is it something to do with the mobile version? Does it look better there?)

Anyway. I guess I am on hiatus for awhile.... Rats.

What I find really grating is not her vitriolic tone (like most of you, this week I enjoy watching republicans acting like douchebags in a sad attempt at hiding their despair).

What I find grating is that the vitriolic, inarticulate parasite is the one being a CNN contributor, taking the job of an actual pundit. Note the word 'inarticulate' here: if you're paid to argue on TV (and regardless of how useful it is) you're expected to do better than throw nothing but invectives for five minutes. If you can't even do that, then please stay at Fox News.