Fixed and thanks.

In reply to this comment by Sarzy:
*dead

http://blogs.wsj.com/law/2007/06/20/justice-scalia-hearts-jack-bauer/

Yeah, what kind of mentality won't embrace the police state and Our Leader, and just disrespects them instead? Why do you insult good Christian values, like perpetual war and torture?

There comes a time when you have to ask yourself, "What would Jack Bauer do?" And if you're going to betray the free market and a Christopathic president by saying that waterboarding is bad then the Islamomarxistchicanofeministsocialistbleedingheartartistfascists have already won. And I wonder what that word even means...but I don't wonder that much.

>> ^quantumushroom:
Don't ask a question if you're not prepared for an answer you might not like. Don't post a sift unless you're prepared for sifters to comment on it.
I wonder at the mentality that continually insults the President, maligns the country, disrespects police and the military, assaults religion (except radical islam) and then dares to be outraged that anyone might oppose these points-of-view...but I don't wonder that much.
Pleasant journey.
In reply to this comment by dystopianfuturetoday:
^We'd all be widowers by now if we abused our significant others every time you said something stupid.

Lithic, I was shocked too that anyone could take 24 seriously. That was until I saw an interview with an instructor at West point. He found that many of his students thought Jack Bauer's character was heroic, and said they would do "whatever it took" to get information that would save American lives.

Young recruits are often naive, full of patriotic zeal, and eager to go out and prove themselves heroes. That's what makes them so malleable, and it's exactly why we go out and recruit kids directly from high school.

I don't mean any insult to brave young people who want to help their country. But maturity, sound judgment, and empathy really are things that come with age. And we shouldn't let anyone lacking those qualities care for prisoners, or deal with foreign civilians.

Tags for this video have been changed from 'underrated, scifi, classic, jack, bauer' to 'underrated, scifi, classic, jack, bauer, rammstein, sonne' - edited by fissionchips

Dealing with hypothetical situations is also a form of presumption because you assume in all the situations you outlined that we know the most but not all of the information, some critical factor.

You are picking out the tree from the forest that is torture. It's impossible to have the situations you outlined, a terrorist being tortured to save the lives of many others, what if you are wrong? What if you end up torturing someone that is innocent? What if the suspect really doesn't know anything? What if all the torture only strengthens the resolve to stay silent, and you end up killing them?

This is the same reason right now the torture methods employed, the information it produced, the tapes of those events are destroyed lost or not given to the public record. Because it simply did not produce results and someone has hell to pay for violating the Geneva conventions and running the US name through the gutter.

Coercion always works better in interrogation. So far all you are doing is presenting fallacious 'what if' scenarios instead of looking at the wider picture of what the usage of such tactics would mean morally, socially and ethically for a nation that uses them. Especially for a democratic nation like the US.

But don't let logic dictate that, please go back to living in Jack Bauer's world where everything is conveniently black and white for you.

The thing I found most shocking about this video is that there are young recruits who think that the character of Jack Bauer is a hero or role model. That we actually allow these kids to carry guns, and interrogate detainees is reckless. I know the military is desperate for soldiers, but we would be doing ourselves (not to mention their victims) a favor if we weeded out the ones who are sadistic, heartless, or just incredibly deluded.

I watched the first few seasons of 24, and found them entertaining despite being ridiculous and melodramatic. Sort of a guilty pleasure. But how could anyone take it seriously?

Jane Meyer from the New Yorker wrote a wondeful article on this back in Feb. 2007 called "Whatever it takes" which talked with Joel Surnow the creator of 24.

This past November, US Army Brigadier General Patrick Finnegan, the dean of the United States Military Academy at West Point, flew to Southern California to meet with the creative team behind "24." Finnegan, who was accompanied by three of the most experienced military and FBI interrogators in the country, arrived on the set as the crew was filming. At first, Finnegan – wearing an immaculate Army uniform, his chest covered in ribbons and medals – aroused confusion: he was taken for an actor and was asked by someone what time his "call" was.

In fact, Finnegan and the others had come to voice their concern that the show's central political premise – that the letter of American law must be sacrificed for the country's security – was having a toxic effect. In their view, the show promoted unethical and illegal behavior and had adversely affected the training and performance of real American soldiers. "I'd like them to stop," Finnegan said of the show's producers. "They should do a show where torture backfires."

Gary Solis, a retired law professor who designed and taught the Law of War for Commanders curriculum at West Point, told the New Yorker that his students would frequently refer to Jack Bauer in discussions of what permissible in the questioning of terrorist suspects.

He said that, under both US and international law, "Jack Bauer is a criminal. In real life, he would be prosecuted." Yet the motto of many of his students was identical to Jack Bauer's: "Whatever it takes." His students were particularly impressed by a scene in which Bauer barges into a room where a stubborn suspect is being held, shoots him in one leg, and threatens to shoot the other if he doesn't talk. In less than ten seconds, the suspect reveals that his associates plan to assassinate the Secretary of Defense. Solis told me, "I tried to impress on them that this technique would open the wrong doors, but it was like trying to stomp out an anthill."

The Christian Science Monitor followed up with the more blunt title of "Does '24' encourage US interrogators to 'torture' detainees?" which culled information from several articles...

Once in a great while a man comes along who changes the world, men like, Benjamin Franklin, Goethe, Martin Luther King Jr., Lee Harvey Oswald, Jack Bauer, Rocky Balboa, and James Earl Ray. Yes these are men of noble standing and and have accomplished much in life.

Karaidl is the complete opposite. On top of being unsure about how to pronounce his name he suffers from many things. All of which he deserves.

For instance his avatar photo of himself is many years old. Now he has to lug his moobs around in a wheelbarrow. His size has grown so massive that he's become the subject of all "yo mamma" jokes.
Karaidl's looser friend: "Hey man, your so fat that you have your own zip code! HAHAHA!
Karaidl: "I'm gonna sit on you mutha****er! Soon as I find my legs!

Sadly the man is everything we hate; The man who puts needles in cupcakes. That jerk who backed into your car with his oversize SUV and didn't leave a note. The pudgy little kid in pre-school who cried in the corner all day. The jerk off teenager who walks around wal mart who thinks that sticking a 'funoodle' in his pants and pretending it's his penis is the greatest idea since he dropped out of high school.

Was he never loved enough as a child? Yes. Was he an outcast and reject of society? You bet. Did he ever give up? No. He kept on being a dickweed despite the fact that we did all we could to ignore him.

So when you think of great men; Mighty Mouse, Ralph Lauren, Vanilla Ice, Michael Jackson, and Lorena Bobbet. Keep thinking about them. Because they are so much more interesting, then this guy I'm roasting, who's name I can't really pronounce!

But Seriously Karaidl, thanks for your contributions to the sift, you always make me laugh.

"I hope we can understand, my friends, that life is not 24 and Jack Bauer..."

Scott Horton and Andrew Sullivan comment...

"The moral clarity and vision of McCain’s answer was perfectly balanced by the bankruptcy of Romney’s. In the end, the former Massachusetts governor ducks by saying that he would turn to his ultimate guru for guidance: Cofer Black, the Vice Chair of Blackwater USA. Mr. Black is known for his bravado, including a pledge to the White House that he would send them Osama bin Laden’s head in a box packed with dry ice. But of course it was Mr. Black who failed in efforts to catch bin Laden and other al Qaeda leaders as they disappeared into the caves and ravines of Tora Bora. He moved from that high accomplishment to Blackwater, which is now engulfed in a series of scandals reflecting questionable management practices. Moreover, CIA officers complain that Black’s move to Blackwater entailed the privatization of vital national security relationships for personal profit, another hallmark of abuse in the Bush Administration.

McCain is turning for guidance to American military tradition and ethics. Romey on the other hand draws on Hollywood cartoons and adventurists. It’s quite a difference. And at the moment, it looks like the Republican base will take Chuck Norris over George Washington and Dwight Eisenhower any day.

Among the other candidates in the Republican field, Huckabee is clearly in the process of transforming his position on the torture question. He’s drawing closer to John McCain’s view with each passing debate. I’ll go out on a limb and say we’ll soon see three Republican candidates taking a clear-cut anti-torture position: John McCain, Ron Paul and Mike Huckabee. Not coincidentally, the first two are the Republican candidates who consistently draw the most support from the active-duty military. Huckabee is clearly intent on pitching more effectively to the same community."

- Scott Horton

"It's a defining issue and this was a defining moment. Romney's pathetic and despicable inability to say that he opposes waterboarding and that waterboarding is torture disqualifies him from the presidency, in my view. If we are going to recover from the profound moral disgrace of the Bush-Cheney torture regime, McCain and Paul are the only Republican candidates who should be considered for the job. I just wish McCain had taken on Giuliani as well. But God bless him. And God bless him for insisting that those who refuse to disown torture should actively support withdrawal from the Geneva Conventions. It's the only honest position to take. I saw the man defeated by Cheney and Addington in 2006 come back to fight again. God bless him."

- Andrew Sullivan

If only Jack Bauer were a cop...

The CIA has always maintained that torture never produces reliable actionable intelligence.

This isn't 24 and Jack Bauer isn't real.

Tags for this video have been changed from '24, jack bauer, pilot, collegehumor' to '24, jack bauer, pilot, collegehumor, payphone, pager, dialup, AOL' - edited by djsunkid

"...unless of course you think that all of us scientists are in on it. <.< >.> <.< Dun. Dun. DUUUUUUHHHHH."
Don't give it away, Doc! That's for season 9, where Jack Bauer tortures the truth out of us and discovers that gravity is a myth and bacteria don't exist!

P.S. The only concerted, controlled destruction the Bush administration is capable of is of itself.

"It's just a matter of time before one of them goes off."

[T-man waterboards rougy]: How much time!! Where is it hidden?!? Don't make me go all Jack Bauer on your ass!