Scahill's twitter feed is a fountain of information in these matters, definatly worth your time.

Anything Scahill is *quality

Boosting this quality contribution up in the Hot Listing - declared quality by ghark.

Relevant:
https://wwws.whitehouse.gov/petitions#!/petition/create-do-not-kill-list/HwqFwRtG

(I hope it goes viral and makes its 25K signatures. This government needs to be embarrassed more.)

The problem I see here are twofold:

1. Cenk is right, this is not a declared war. I wish we would declare a war as it would probably speed things up. That and if it was a war, the US would probably be more justified to have that collateral damage in order to get a terrorist.

2. If terrorists discover that we won't shoot at them if they're surrounded by civvies. They'd just use them as shields. So while I have a problem with the fact that we're over there in the first place. The sooner we get on clean energy and aren't so dependent on middle east oil, the sooner we can wipe our hands of the whole region and we can leave them to their own devices and their justification for terrorizing us would decrease or be eliminated.

but the fact of the matter is, we are there and you fight to win, and yeah, war isn't pretty, war isn't fair and I hate to say it but those civilians were just in the wrong place at the wrong time.

sucks..but so does war....want shit like this to stop? seems like a pretty good motivation for us to get the fuck out of there and eliminate our dependence on oil.

Chomsky was right...Bush jailed people without trials indefinitely. Obama skips that step and goes straight to murder. It isn't legal, it isn't moral, Obama is worse than Bush and the American Empire is still kicking. We need to put it down here at home if we're going to have a chance at a civilized life.

>> ^Yogi:

Chomsky was right...Bush jailed people without trials indefinitely. Obama skips that step and goes straight to murder. It isn't legal, it isn't moral, Obama is worse than Bush and the American Empire is still kicking. We need to put it down here at home if we're going to have a chance at a civilized life.


I'll take a wild guess that everything Cenk is talking about most certainly did happen in Afghanistan and Iraq first during our dear leader "Junior Bush", let alone "during the Obama administration". I won't bother to say any more than that as any president that must inevitable go to war with another nation has failed his people (to some extent, some leaders are given no choice and some are caught off guard--but many use it like it's a fraternal right of the presidency--make war and no one complains) and we WILL be committing murder on the large scale, that will always be a partial description and definition of war; except for a few extraneous and special circumstances were we defend ourselves, but in the end we turn into the monster we tried not to be: WWI, WWII, Vietnam, Korea, Bosnia, Iraq (twice), Afghanistan, South VS. North USA, even the Cold War and are malicious proxy wars...

Trust me this has been around a long time, might as well bring up the every presidents "expenditure" or whatever they ended up calling it in those days and ages. War really is one side murdering the other for not a single good reason between the two, but their own bigotry created by...

...Organizations (like Al Qaeda) are capable of strikes that can affect a city block (a large suicide bomb) typically and in a grand while one that effects perhaps 20 blocks (the World Trade Center, which was felt "afterwards much farther away than 20 blocks, it circled the globe)... But, overall they have an effect on a much smaller section of people. It's hard to decide what to give up sometimes as we see others suffering, but we do wish to help them. At some point though an organization is a small group that becomes a country; like our Republicans and Democrats, two flavors of a one flavor system (unless you like pure batshiat crazy, we have that one too).