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Government creates inflation

newtboy says...

To my “the fool”-
Again you lie. Point to when I ever said that you fucktard. I have ALWAYS said deficit matters, so does intelligent spending, so does overall debt, so does our national credit rating. All went to shit faster than ever before or since under your dementia riddled crime boss.

Your brain is mush. You just make up nonsense constantly, then contradict yourself.
It was you who said for 4 years that deficits don’t matter while your idiot ran up the deficit and debt faster than ever before and I shouted daily that he was bankrupting the nation and not getting anything for it, at least Biden invested his spending in America, didn’t waste it on useless trade wars, tax breaks for the ultra rich (that didn’t trickle down or stimulate the economy) and PPP handout loans to business “owners” (that didn’t have to be repaid and were ripe with fraud because there were no standards, no vetting, because it was in fact designed to be easy to defraud and was the most fraudulent assistance program in history) and other ego driven stupidity that gained nothing, all this at America’s expense with no benifits.

I have never once said anything nearly so stupid. You have often. Let me ask (for you to ignore the question because you hate the answer)…who had the last balanced budget…who last paid down the debt? Hint- it rhymes with Minton. Which party presided over the last 3 major recessions? Hint- they all wear red ties.

You denied spending mattered when it was out of control under maga leadership, you have absolutely not been saying this all along you liar. When I said starting in early 2020 that Trump’s out of control spending spree and crashed economy in 2020 would result in high inflation… you denied it was related, then blamed Biden when the predicted inflation spike hit.

Government needs to spend wisely, not for ego and spite like Trump spent. Biden spent a lot, but it revived the economy much faster than any other Western nation after Covid and improved GDP significantly….after Trump’s Covid response was the worst in any Western nation by far making killing Americans at 5 times the percapita average worldwide and turning our GDP to a negative for the first time in history in peace time.

The Republicans have blocked a balanced budget for decades, but we do have a budget, moron. Their obstruction, trying to shut down the government out of spite has lowered our credit rating costing billions or trillions for absolutely no gains.

Maga would prefer no government at all and is actively working against the government functioning, but these idiots can’t see past their “freedom” (freedom to be horrifically evil, racist, uncivil, and inhumane) to understand that we would become Russia or China in a week, and their little home protection guns and fake “militia” clubs won’t kill a single soldier in the invasion.

Still waiting you ballless wonder. Such a whining little cowardly infant…DJ really turned you into a petty, uneducated, idiotic pansy boy. Must be all that fantasizing about sucking the mushroom tip. It’s hilarious your insecurity forces you to keep displaying your insecurity publicly, incapable of admitting you’ve ever been w-w-w-wrong (despite your never actually being right, especially when it comes to speaking English) because you’re so insecure you are certain that if you admitted you made a mistake no one will love you. 😂

bobknight33 said:

Your the fool that keeps saying deficit does not matter.
Now you want to claim otherwise. Funny.



I've been saying this all along.

Government need a budget not CRs.

This non budget has been going on for nearly 20 years.

bobknight33 (Member Profile)

bobknight33 says...

projecting is what Democrats do.

IQ less that 90? Tested decades ago but it was 124
Find a Engineer with IQ less that 90.

Biden Economy is doing great. Would be better if lock downs were eliminated.
We can thank Trump for it due to the tax cuts which stimulated strong growth. Democrats wold raise they if they could and then we could go back to the appalling 1.5 20% GDP rate under OBAMA.


Biden and the Democrat party are so out of step with what Americans want that they will get a beat down in the mid terms. Do yo not see this coming?

Even main stream media is coming to this conclusion. And they carry the Democrat water day in day out.

Tesla not in a bubble. They will crush legacy auto makers this decade.
They are gowning 20% qtr/qtr and 70% YoY .

I have about 1400 shares and have no plans to sell for 5 years or so.


.


newtboy said:

Aaaaahahahaha! Stop projecting, Bob.

ROTFLMFAHS!!! 139 IQ Bob. Excelling in college level classes at 6th grade. Over 10 years of higher education….including critical thinking. I know you wouldn’t post your actual IQ score because it’s double digits, and the first digit is not 9.

You know full well you’re the uneducated ignoramus living in a fantasy world here, still spreading the big lie with no evidence, just like 99% of what you’ve said in the last 13 years (yes, you lost your mind over Obama and have only gotten worse under The Biggest Loser, the convicted con man and consummate liar.)

MY head is up MY ass!?! LMFAHS!!! You have the long term verified clinical diagnosis of cranial rectosis….I know it colors your viewpoint, but that shit you see is in your eyes, not on me. Too funny, Ms Iknowyouarebutwhatami.

Bob, you know how often the partisan nonsense you spout is wrong, verifiably and definitely wrong, based on blatant lies? More than 9/10. You still think Trump won, or at least that there was massive democratic fraud last election, despite no evidence, despite a dozen times you were told the evidence would be released tomorrow, but when tomorrow came there was nothing, despite multiple audits, including the hyper partisan unofficial biased vote review that found hundreds of votes for Biden but zero evidence of vote fraud, despite 62 failed attempts to prove any fraud in court, despite dozens upon dozens of accusations that all turned out to be misrepresentation, misunderstandings, and outright lies, but not evidence, despite Mike Pillow, crazy moronic crackhead that can’t produce a cogent thought much less evidence of fraud being the failed clearly insane spokesman for the movement. (He now claims he has proof every American over 7 committed vote fraud that can put us all in prison for life)

You like to spout insanity, see it debunked with facts figures and citations, and slink away so you don’t have to try to defend the indefensible or admit you were w-w-w-wrong. When I make a claim, you rebut it with a “nuh-uh…your dum!” and think you won an argument when you haven’t offered one….and I still bother to verify them with facts, figures, and often multiple citations to prove my point anyway.

Tesla stock was a good deal 3 years ago, not today. It’s a bubble, one day it will pop. Better get out before then. My increases came largely from a ton of S&P, various energy stocks and medical stocks, and some tech. I sold my J&J before their vaccine flopped, knowing they have billions in lawsuits to lose soon. My one account went up >30% this year. I made more than if it was all in Tesla (> 30% vs Tesla at 24% for the year)….and I don’t have a PE ratio of 360 indicating a major correction in the future, and I get dividends. If China comes up with a better battery, you better sell immediately. They’ve done well, but are unstable, randomly fluctuating, not secure, and run by a nut that doesn’t care about hurting his own stock prices (or manipulates them for his own gain, I can’t be sure).

Please name these failures, I don’t think you can. You’ve listed the economy, insanely better under Biden, unemployment, insanely better under Biden, immigration, still using the Trump era rules and methods (so there’s one), Inflation, Trump devalued the dollar by 30% and only paused inflation for a year by halting the economy, actually making it a negative growth. Covid, lol. The people responsible for the lack of Covid response are your people, the people who are still unvaccinated and still having problems are idiot Republicans. Covid was, and is a right wing caused issue, fortunately it now effects mostly right wing morons, they should be banned from hospitals, they chose to be vulnerable.

He has failed to remove disastrous Trump appointees, projects, policies, and programs. He’s failed to pass more thorough infrastructure (build back better) but has gotten infrastructure funding. He’s going to fail to secure voting rights thanks to 100% Republican obstructionism, true, unless there’s a miracle in November.

CNN leader in fake news? WHAT?! I suppose maybe, because OAN, Newsmax, and Fox along with all the other right wing media aren’t news at all, they’re dishonest propaganda channels that lie to you daily….and you just fucking love it, you love the lies, and because you love them you believe them, and for no other reason because there’s never evidence for your lies….that’s why you disappear so often, caught in too many lies and called out on them, proven wrong, and you don’t have the spine to admit it. Coward. Use the same criteria and CNN beats every right wing outlet for honesty, correctness, willingness to correct mistakes, and their lack of involvement in a violent attack against the country and democracy, you fool.

Racing for $100

bobknight33 says...

Its not where you start in life its where you end up.

White privilege is a false statement. Its really middle class privilege. Its about education not skin color. There are plenty of poor whites as much as there are poor blacks.


Those in the back mostly without fathers.
All knowing Newt, What is the fix?

Economic hardship of those kids would be lesson if both parents were present.


Finally JOBS or lack of them are mostly due to government policies ( Fair trade / Free Trade) have decimated job opportunities for All Americans, especially low wage and entry jobs.


Make policies that bring jobs back to America. Passing bills that take tax dollars and make roads or such only create short term jobs.

Trump was right Lower business tax rates to compete on world stage stimulated economy and America started to flourish.

Sadly Biden/ Democrats want to move tax rate up which will slow down growth, if passed.


Learn???
My dad started working at 14, His dad never got passed 8th grade.
My dad went bankrupt, had a chronically ill wife ( died in early 40s due to it) and 4 kids.

He never left. He worked his ass off.

Also he broke his back in 3 places and crushed his right hand. He left the hospital to sign a house mortgage, knowing he might never work again.
With a healing back and crippled hand he drove 50 miles each way in a stick shift car for 3 years like this just to keep a roof over our heads.

I paid my own way through college, Same for my sister.

My dad says If you want it bad enough you will find a way.

So don't tell be about white privilege bull shit.

What about Black lawyers, Drs, and ball players?
They make way more coin than most white people. Do they have white privilege?

The person making minimum wage likes it enough to stay, else he will find a better paying job.


Should fines, penalties be smaller for poor people , yes.

newtboy said:

@bobknight33 , you need to watch and learn.

Fauci

newtboy says...

In part, he has more than one iron in the debt exploding fire.

He exploded the debt long before Covid.
The checks alone would have exploded the debt, but that was less than1/4 of the money spent on just the Trumpidemic his lack of leadership and understanding made 10 times worse than it could have been, and that's being generous, and that two trillion + doesn't count one dime of the trillions more in lost production....and he wants to spend/grift trillions more, but not a dollar for checks to taxpayers...maybe in late October but not now.
Then there's his tax cut for the rich, stimulated the economy and created jobs great, didn't it? (Hint, of course it didn't, it just bankrupt the treasury while jobs and the economy dissolved, his normal business practice, but America is the Trump Casino this time).
How much have his trade wars cost?
Then there's that short bit of wall nay fence Mexico didn't pay for, getting more expensive every day.

You're the one who is hyper anti socialism, and you were incredibly outraged at the size of the debt before Trump and insistent he would erase it term one, but you're keeping your socialist handout even as your boy raids and bankrupts the treasury with your blessing, aren't you.

bobknight33 said:

" explode the debt" by shoveling out coin to PEOPLEduring this covid mess.

You can give you coin back if you feel so badly.

The Walk.

Janus says...

While I can't stand Trump, I have to wonder how well Biden would do now. He at least seemed to still be in possession of all (or most) of his faculties back in 2016. Both Biden and Trump seem to be having serious lapses over the past few months, at least. Seemingly worse for Biden, actually, though that might just be down to heavy use of stimulants on Trump's part.

The fact that these two candidates are our presumptive options for president is a dumpster fire.

Grreta Thunberg's Speech to World Leaders at UN

newtboy says...

@bcglorf Here's a tome for you....


It's certainly not (the only way). Converting to green energy sources stimulates the economy, it doesn't bankrupt it, and it makes it more efficient in the future thanks to lower energy costs. My solar system paid for itself in 8 years, giving me an expected 12 years of free electricity and hot water. Right wingers would tell you it will never pay for itself....utter bullshit.

Every gap in our knowledge I've ever seen that we have filled with data has made the estimates worse. Every one. Every IPCC report has raised the severity and shrunk the timeframe from the last report....but you stand on the last one that they admit was optimistic and incomplete by miles as if it's the final word and a gold standard. It just isn't. They themselves admit this.

The odds of catastrophic climate change is 100% in the next 0 years for many who have already died or been displaced by rising seas or famine or disease or lack of water or...... and that goes for all humanity in the next 50 because those who survive displacement will be refugees on the rest's doorsteps. Don't be ridiculous. If we found an asteroid guaranteed to hit in the next 50-100 years, and any possible solutions take a minimum of 50 years to implement with no surprises, and only then assuming we solve the myriad of technical issues we haven't solved in the last 100 years of trying and only if we can put the resources needed into a solution, not considering the constantly worsening barrage of smaller asteroids and the effects on resources and civilisation, we would put all our resources into solutions. That's where I think we are, except we still have many claiming there's no asteroid coming and those that already hit are fake news....including those in the highest offices making the decisions.

Every IPCC report has vastly underestimated their projections, they tell you they are doing it, only including data they are certain of, not new measurements or functions. They do not fill in the gaps, they leave them empty. Gaps like methane melt that could soon be more of a factor than human CO2, and 100% out of our control.

The AR5 report is so terrible, it was lambasted from day one as being incredibly naive and optimistic, and for not including what was then new data. Since its release, those complaints have been proven to be correct, in 5 years since its release ice melt rates have accelerated 60 years by their model. I wouldn't put a whit of confidence in it, it was terrible then, near criminally bad today. I'll take NOAA's estimates based on much newer science and guess that they, like nearly all others in the past, also don't know everything and are also likely underestimating wildly. Even the IPCC AR5 report includes the possibility of 3 ft rise by 2100 under their worst case (raised another 10% in this 2019 report, and expected to rise again by 2021, their next report), and their worst case models show less heat and melting than we are measuring already and doesn't include natural feedbacks because they can't model them accurately yet so just left them out (but noted they will have a large effect, but it's not quantitative yet so not included). Long and short, their worst case scenario is likely optimistic as reality already outpaces their worst case models.

Again, the economy benefits from new energy production in multiple ways. Exxon is not the global economy.

It took 100 years for the impact of our pollution to be felt by most (some still ignore it today). Even the short term features like methane take 25+ years to run their cycles, so what we do today takes that long to start working.

If people continue to drag their feet and challenge the science with supposition, insisting the best case scenario of optimistic studies are the worst we should plan for, we're doomed....and what they're doing is actually worse than that. The power plants built or under construction today put us much higher than 1.5 degree rise by 2100 with their expected emissions without ever building 1 more, and we're building more. Without fantastic scientific breakthroughs that may never come, breakthroughs your plan relies on for our survival, what we've already built puts us beyond the IPCC worst case in their operational lifetimes.

There's a problem with that...I'm good with using real science to identify them without political obstruction and confusion, the difference being we need to be prepared for decisive action once they're identified. So far, we have plans to develop those actions, but that's it. In the event of a "surprise" asteroid, we're done. We just hope they're rare.
This one, however, is an asteroid that is guaranteed to hit if we do nothing, some say hit in 30 years, some say 80. Only morons say it won't hit at all, do nothing.
Climate change is an asteroid/comet in our orbit that WILL hit earth. We are already being hit by ejecta from it's coma causing disasters for millions. You suggest we don't start building a defense until we are certain of it's exact tonnage and the date it will crash to earth because it's expensive and our data incomplete. That plan leaves us too late to change the trajectory. The IPCC said we need to deploy our system in 8-10 years to have a 30-60% chance of changing the trajectory under perfect conditions....you seem to say "wait, that's expensive, let's give it some time and ignore that deadline". I say even just a continent killer is bad enough to do whatever it takes to stop, because it's cheaper with less loss of life and infinitely less suffering than a 'wait and see exactly when it will kill us, we might have space elevators in 10 years so it might only kill 1/2 of us and the rest might survive that cometary winter in space (yes at exponentially higher cost and loss of life and ecology than developing the system today, but that won't be on my dime so Fuck it).' attitude.

Why This Anesthesiologist Quit

newtboy says...

Know who you take advice from....
Just gonna leave this here....

Wiki-
Dr Michael Klaper-In August 1993 Klaper issued a medical certificate for the insurers of two movies that River Phoenix was working on at the time, Dark Blood and Interview With the Vampire. The certificate was signed by both Klaper and Phoenix and stated that Phoenix had never used "LSD, heroin, cocaine, alcohol in excess, or any other narcotic, depressant, stimulant or psychedelic. At the time Phoenix was deeply into the drug scene and died from a drug overdose two months later on October 31, 1993. Phoenix's death resulted in Dark Blood being scrapped, and his role in Interview with the Vampire being replaced by Christian Slater. A total $US5.7 million was paid out by the insurers of both movies as the result of Phoenix's death. Since Phoenix's death, insurance rates have increased significantly, medical certificates are no longer accepted, and actors are required to undergo more rigorous medical examination prior to being insured. [23]

According to oncologist David Gorski "Klaper subscribes to the all-too-common claim that a vegan diet is better than any other and supplements that claim with a belief that undergoing fasts, in which one consumes only water, is a major part of the path to health and wellness". He supports multiple pseudoscience medical claims such as acupuncture, chiropractic, naturopathy and border-line "germ theory denialism". Klaper also gives "highly dubious advice for cancer patients, even claiming that fasting can shrink malignant tumors. Klaper claims that fasts will clear up inflammation, eczema, arthritis and other issues. "The situation" according to Gorski, is "way more complicated than Dr. Klaper paints it". As a surgeon himself, Gorski is appalled that Klaper claims that fasting encourages "faster wound healing" a statement that Gorski calls "Bullshit!". Magician Penn Jillette reported on multiple podcasts that he has lost over 25 pounds on Klaper's water fast diet, Gorski responded that of course he will lose weight on a water-only diet. In Gorski's opinion as a medical doctor himself, "Jillette has fallen "hook, line, and sinker for a whole lot of dietary pseudoscience and promoting it on his show with a credulous interview with someone like Dr. Klaper". Gorski hopes that Jillette will eventually realize "that Dr. Klaper is peddling highly dubious claims (at best). Basically, the product Dr. Klaper is peddling in terms of science is a massive exaggeration based on dubious science, cherry picked cases, and bad evolutionary analogies. Worse, fasts, even when supervised by a physician, are potentially dangerous"

Making the 1886 Coca Cola Recipe

AeroMechanical says...

It's a real shame about the coca leaves. Not a fan cocaine as a recreational drug in typical recreational quantities, but for the equivalent level of stimulant effect it's way better than caffeine. It's got all the benefits of caffeine without the unwanted side effects. It's not as long lasting, and you get the improvement in focus, energy and concentration without the lingering physical stimulation and mind-racing jittery stuff caffeine causes.

Baby finds door stop

New Rule: The Good Sex Economy

heropsycho says...

MAGA isn't anything. It's as vague as "Hope and Change". It's a slogan.

Starting trade wars that wreck the economy is a bad thing. Deregulation that harms the economy is a bad thing. A lot of his policies are bad things.

And before you say, "well, the economy is doing great!" or "black unemployment is at an all time low", or whatever fact that completely ignores the macroeconomic phenomenon known as the business cycle, remember that national economic policy takes time to take effect. Instituted properly, it keeps the economic dips at recession level lows and duration, not 2008 level catastrophes. Aside from emergency measures such as those instituted during 2009, the federal government can't generally have immediate impacts. It'll take awhile.

I'll even go on record as saying that a recession under Trump is virtually inevitable even if he conducted good policy. The measure of his policies will turn into how bad the recession ends up being, and how well the damage is contained.

And that's the problem. Because of his tax cuts, he's put us into larger deficit spending mode in a time that we didn't need it. Macroeconomically, it was time to run surpluses. But he didn't care. In fact, he cared so little, he didn't even just keep deficit spending at where it was. He made it worse.

So when the other shoe drops, there won't be many mechanisms left to do other than lower interest rates when they're already low aside from sacrifice future economic growth when we have to deficit spend out the ass to stimulate the economy.

And the worst part is his poor decisions, when it's evident they were poor, reversing them won't help end a recession. If you realize a trade war screwed us, removing the tariffs doesn't in the short run increase consumer spending because people won't have jobs to buy those goods, and if the recession is globally felt (which it will be), Chinese people will have less money to buy American goods.

Taxing the rich more in the short run doesn't put more money into consumers' hands who would actually spend it. In fact, that reduces capital at a time when capital would help build new businesses to hire more people.

Not that any of this is surprising. Trump has no idea how macroeconomics work. He talks like he does, but he doesn't. Just says stuff that sounds obvious and easy to understand, and too many people fell for it.

But the reckoning is coming. It always does.

bobknight33 said:

So MAGA is a bad thing? How foolish!

Bumblebee - Teaser Trailer

cloudballoon says...

Considering this is a Bumblebee movie, I like that the movie evokes the feelz of 80/90's robot movies like Johnny 5 & Iron Giant. I'm open-minded & I can accept a warmhearted TF movie and kids will love for the sweetness of some characters.

Non-sense explosions in Bay's TF movies (and a lot of other blockbusters) doesn't stimulate my senses and put me to sleep...

Asmo (Member Profile)

bareboards2 says...

I just now saw this. My yahoo email account sometimes disappears things on me. I lost another email about the same time.

I absolutely agree with everything you say. Biology is biology. There are differences. Sex is in the workplace, of course, and women bring it there.

I can agree with all these things, and still be creeped out by the indulgence, the wallowing, of only hiring very attractive women.

There is a long history of that in America, and it was creepy then, too. Stewardesses and what they were subjected to in the workplace is a great example. They would lose their -- THEIR WORK -- if they gained five pounds, is an example of really inappropriate use of a woman's appearance as a job qualification. These people are responsible for the safety of the passengers if a tragedy strikes. I love reading stories about how women are heroes and professional when an accident happens.

A shooting range is not a strip club. Wanting to be surrounded by women in your business who COULD work in a strip club is creepy.

Creepy really isn't the right word. It is shorthand for a complex interplay of gender roles and abuses and complicity that is endemic in our culture. I just like the way it feels in my mouth -- I found that Japanese word for it that perfectly explains my pleasure in using it. I am still pleased to know that word exists.

Gitaigo: Onomatopoeia that describes states of being, not sounds.

Creepy perfectly feels like my state of being around this video.

We are all biological beings who like to look at pretty people. Tall men make more money. Attractive people of both genders make more money. We will never be free from those responses.

But lets keep it unconscious, shall we? Let us work to be better human beings than people who reduce ourselves to walking genitalia looking for constant stimulation.

The rest of your points... yeah. I'm right with you. I am not someone who criticizes men for "looking." I find myself looking and I'm pretty firmly on the hetero side of things.

It came up the other day on a hike through the woods. A woman passed me wearing some sort of body hugging stretch pants. There was natural jiggling from her movements, which caught my eye. I found myself staring, I became aware of how perfectly proportioned she was, and how the rest of her was lovely in every aspect (I had seen her a few moments before, walking in a different direction.) I almost called out to my friends -- my god, that is the most beautiful woman. All triggered by a chance glance at an objectively beautiful rear-end.

Biology. It happens. I have no problem with it.

And those shooting range owners want to stimulate that reaction in the workplace, 100% of the time. And that, my friend, is creepy.

Asmo said:

I was responding to your comments, as I understood them, and if I got the wrong impression, I apologise. But I think it's somewhat blinkered to say that it's men that bring sex in to the workplace. eg. Most of the young ladies that work in the same building as me wear short skirts or tight pants, lots of decolletage on display etc. That is absolutely their right as long as they meet the dress code of their employer, but it certainly brings sex appeal firmly in to the limelight.

Unfortunately, while men are seen as rather simple creatures biologically when it comes to sex, there is more than meets the eye. The science certainly isn't conclusive, but there is a lot of evidence pointing to desire being a function of the amygdala, which is strongly stimulated by visuals in men. The following article is a pop news summary of a longer (and fairly dry) study which I couldn't find an non-subscription version of, which compares brain activity in response to viewing porn images for both men and women.

http://www.nytimes.com/2004/03/16/health/in-sex-brain-studies-show-la-difference-still-holds.html

Women still get aroused by the images, but the desire that is evoked in the male amygdala is not replicated in the female. Hence men tend to respond far better to objectification than women do. There are other results with further delve the difference between male and female sexuality, and it's not surprising that society as a whole has been molded by our biology.

Probably also explains, at least somewhat, why men (myself included) find it hard to accept criticism for something that comes naturally to most of us. Few men would go to a public place with the express purpose of leering at attractive women, but almost all men (at least the straight ones) will find themselves gazing for longer than perhaps polite at certain women that catch our eye. That is not to take away from the fact that we are generally in charge of our actions, but it certainly adds an imperative that is less about being creepy and more about our biology.

Nerdwriter - How Not To Adapt A Movie

cloudballoon says...

By risk aversion I meant intellectually, not financially. It would be a rarity for Hollywood to give us anything with a deep plot/philosophical in a blockbuster. Heck even a sensical plot to not easy to come by these days.

I don't expect too much in a blockbuster, it's meant to be loud, and fun first & foremost, meant to stimulate the senses more than the brain. A really good plot is an appreciated good bonus, not expectation.

I am glad GitS is doing well. Much more deserving than TF:TLK at least IMO.

00Scud00 said:

And yet all that risk aversion got them a whopping 169 million world wide.

Straight is the new gay - Steve Hughes

newtboy says...

Can't argue that. I've been in California so long that the idea of smoking inside a business didn't even occur to me. The 'in private homes with children and apartments or townhouses' part I find draconian and unenforceable...and we have them here.
On a side note, I also find it distasteful that cigars get lumped in with cigarettes. As far as I know, there have been few if any studies on second hand cigar smoke, which has none of the toxic additives most cigarettes have so produce a different smoke. I'm not saying it's good for you, just that it hasn't been proven to be the same kind of toxicity....yet they are now taxed the same here, doubling the price overnight. (If you can't tell, I'm bitter, I can't afford them now)

True, cars have far more utility (except to tobacco farmers) but are also far more damaging in many ways. It's not meant to be a logical argument, it's more about getting people to see that they also pollute the air (a normal complaint I hear about smokers) in a directly more deadly and indirectly disastrous way, and I hope they will consider that before angrily deriding someone for a cigarette. It's a disguised 'people in glass houses' argument.

Sadly, yes, smoking is an easy target today....alcohol could be tomorrow, or marijuana again (just became legal here)....I don't like our governments going after the easy targets heavy handedly just because they can. It's too easy to portray something or someone as an easy target and go after it solely because a small persuasive group finds it distasteful.

To play devils advocate, there are a few positive sides to smoking...smoking tastes good (to smokers), it acts as a stimulant/depressant and appetite suppressor, it supports an industry of farmers and for cigars, hand rollers, and it helps thin out the herd. ;-)

ChaosEngine said:

First, I'm not talking about smoking outdoors. The conversation specifically relates to pubs (and restaurants, I guess). If you want to smoke outdoors, it's not such a big deal.

Second, cars have utility. Whether you think more people should cycle or use public transport or whatever, you can't argue that banning cars wouldn't be a massive shock to the economy, and the way people live. Smoking? Not so much.

Finally, smoking tends to get it in the neck, because it's EASY to regulate. Regulating healthy food is a nightmare, considering there isn't even universal agreement on what constitutes a healthy diet. But there's no positive side to smoking, so it tends to get regulated.

So Much CO2 That Trees Can't Save Us

greatgooglymoogly says...

*related https://videosift.com/video/Climatologist-Emotional-Over-Arctic-Methane-Hydrate-Release

It likely is too late, as soon as these short-lived but potent gases are released it will get unpleasant very quickly. I know dumping iron in the ocean to stimulate algae growth which then sinks as acts as a carbon sink has been discussed. Also, spraying aerosols into the upper atmosphere constantly can decrease warming, but that doesn't reduce the CO2.



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