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imstellar28 (Member Profile)

NetRunner says...

And I'm saying I can't even fathom why you would think the one necessarily implies the other.

In fairness, I must confess that I didn't really get what you were trying to say here:

Stealing is the absence of an action, which is why it is a valid human right. I'm not stealing anything from you (of my own free will) so what other action do you wish me to perform? Healthcare, or food or water for that matter, is not the absence of an action but rather material goods.

Let me start by saying, stealing is an action someone performs. I think perhaps you meant to say that the right to property depends on the absence of stealing from others?

I guess the implication here is that you reject the idea that rights could ever demand action on the part of others?

If you jump out in front of a moving car, does the driver have an obligation to try to stop?

In reply to this comment by imstellar28:
Your analogy isn't valid, but even if it was it doesn't really answer what I am saying. It's fine if you think people are morally obligated to feed the hungry, or you want the government tax dollars to be spent on such things, but why is there the need to call it a human right? It's misleading and intellectually dishonest.

If I have the right to be fed, then you have the obligation to feed me. If you really believe that why won't you buy me dinner?

In reply to this comment by imstellar28:
Stealing is the absence of an action, which is why it is a valid human right. I'm not stealing anything from you (of my own free will) so what other action do you wish me to perform? Healthcare, or food or water for that matter, is not the absence of an action but rather material goods. If you wish to claim such things are a right (a noble goal) then you would have to ensure that you can provide those things to the 7 billion inhabitants of this planet. I wish someone could do such things but it's clearly not possible -- hence why material goods or services can never be a "human right."

imstellar28 (Member Profile)

NetRunner says...

I can't provide habeas corpus or freedom of religion for the whole world either. It doesn't change my view on whether I think every human being is entitled to it.

For that matter I tend to think people have a "right to life", but nobody can abolish death, or even just murder. I think we can do a lot for starvation and sickness, and probably a lot more about murder as well, but none of these things come free.

So I ask people to willingly agree to legal arrangements that establish these things as legal rights to services, and legal obligations to taxes, at least within the region known as "the United States".

Then they call this a violation of their rights, because, you know, taxes are evil or something. At a minimum, they come up with some arbitrary meta-definition of rights that they insist should supersede my own conception of rights.

And to be frustrating, I don't have rigid rules surrounding the limits of what people's rights should be. I tend to think of it in terms of what kind of injustice it would be to deny it to someone. Denying me a Ferrari doesn't seem so unjust. Denying someone the ability to see a doctor when they're ill, even if they're a convicted murderer, doesn't seem right.

In reply to this comment by imstellar28:
Stealing is the absence of an action, which is why it is a valid human right. I'm not stealing anything from you (of my own free will) so what other action do you wish me to perform? Healthcare, or food or water for that matter, is not the absence of an action but rather material goods. If you wish to claim such things are a right (a noble goal) then you would have to ensure that you can provide those things to the 7 billion inhabitants of this planet. I wish someone could do such things but it's clearly not possible -- hence why material goods or services can never be a "human right."

imstellar28 (Member Profile)

NetRunner says...

You really should try to walk through why you think this is somehow a trap for people who think healthcare is a right.

I feel like I've been stolen from because my government taxes me. Send me a trillion dollars to raise an army to overthrow them.

Don't bother with the Paypal, I won't accept your fraudulent fiat currency. Gold bars are the only form of payment I'll accept.

C'mon, cough it up, this is a matter of human rights, and you have an obligation to me that extends beyond any form of government practical ideas about how to best guarantee those rights.


In reply to this comment by imstellar28:
We aren't talking about taxes we are talking about human rights. If it is human right you have an obligation to me that extends beyond any form of government, yes?

So, do you want my PayPal address?
>> ^NetRunner:

>> ^imstellar28:
Also, I'm feeling a little under the weather today. Can you guys go ahead and send $100 my way so I can pick up some medicine at the store?

Yes, as long as what we're really talking about is me paying my taxes, and that gets used to pay for your (and my) medical bills.

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NetRunner says...

We'll see. Conway is gonna let it drop, sorta, largely because there are substantive things wrong with Paul's policies, and would rather drive the focus back towards that, now that the press-bait of Aqua Buddha has done its job.

In reply to this comment by AmandaF:
Buddha is being brought up again and again. Paul is nevertheless facing the disappointment of his university-days prank. The NoZe brotherhood was a group of students Rand Paul was a part of at Baylor. The group was founded to trigger aggravation for the administration. The disputed reports of the NoZe Brotherhood cover an array of intrusions. One of the many stories is that they kidnapped a female and asked her to "worship the Aqua Buddha". This is a little embarrassing for Paul, I wonder if there is enough personal loans in this world to sweep this under the rug.

Learning Piano to Get Laid (with Bo Burnham) Vol. 1

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