First up, bring back the old quoting system!

"I'm of the opinion that both Hillary and Trump would make bad presidents."

Agreed.

"That being said, I don't really believe the narrative that Trump would be the worse of the two; the "apocalyptic" one to elect. Trump is incompetent and chaotic. Hillary is greasy and corrupt."

Which one has campaigned for a law that flagrantly violates the first amendment? Which one has called an entire demographic of US citizens rapists and murderers?

" I think the system (which is actually pretty well designed at its core..."

The American political system is a complete clusterfuck. You have a two party monopoly, the electoral college is a disaster and then there's Citizens United.

"The DNC had a chance to put in another option that would have easily had as much support from core Democrats as Hillary, but also would have energized younger voters AND been a very attractive option for Republicans who don't buy in to Trump (of which there are many). But instead, they left their fingers on the scales and tipped things in favor of Hillary."

Completely agree. Instead of the excitement of a Bernie running, you have the "ugh, Hillary, I guess" attitude.

"So, I'll vote for one of the 3rd party candidates (I like Stein's stance on Snowden, so probably her) or write in the option that crooked DNC and Hillary denied us. Either of those actions is de-facto more likely to result in President Trump, and I acknowledge that. But like I said, I'm OK with that -- I honestly believe Hillary would be worse, and the main thing is that me and other people like me have to send a message to both parties that they need to present us with more reasonable candidates if they expect us to have any degree of the "party loyalty" that both sides expected / enjoyed in the past. This election cycle shows that they are taking that for granted -- so screw 'em."

And here we have the major issue. I have NO IDEA how people think electing Trump will somehow bring down the system. "Screw 'em"?? As in the dems and the gop? It won't bother them in the slightest.

But it will bother Mexicans, Muslims, LGBT people and em.... damnit, there was another demographic that the Republicans want to fuck over.... oh yeah... women.

Forget Trump. As much of an unconscionable arsehole as he is, look at the GOP platform for 2016:
- tax cuts for the rich
- repeal environmental protections
- an anti-abortion amendment
- oppose stem cell research
- prop up the electoral college
- ignore climate change agreements
- repeal obamacare
- abolish net neutrality
- oppose same-sex marriage
- abstinence-based sex education
- increase military spending
- the ridiculous and wasteful border wall

and finally, appoint a new Supreme Court Judge to push all this through. And THAT is the real reason Trump can't be allowed to be President. Say what you want about Hillary, but at least she won't choose a complete loon for the supreme court. Trump might pick David Duke, for all we know.

It's just so fucking amazing that they've doubled down on "until we figure out what's going on" as a yardstick for policy, I goddamn love it. All policies should be phrased like this - "the war on drugs will continue, until somebody is able to tell me what the deal is!" "No stem cell research until somebody straightens out what's with all the confusion!" "Our troops will stay in Afghanistan until we know what it is we're doing!"

You say; "I don't think it's really religious people stifling stem cell research. I think it's more corporations like the pharmaceuticals."
Wrong. It is the religious lobbyists who blocked it - the same ones who, in some states, block the freedom of a woman to choose an abortion.If you seriously think that religion plays no part, try running for president as an atheist. No, science finds a way. It has now bypassed the need for stem cells, by using ordinary cells to the same end. Science for the win.
And btw, pharmaceutical companies exist to have the best product on the market and, therefore, make money to invest in future/better products. It's called capitalism, which you appear to be against.
Your argument is simply ill-informed, reactionary, and frivolous.

I don't think it's really religious people stifling stem cell research. I think it's more corporations like the pharmaceuticals. Also the fact that it's government research that might actually help people so immediately it's on the chopping block.

I've seen some religious arguments against stem cells and they sure are stupid, but nothing has convinced me that's what's pulling the strings. Like the attacks on Planned Parenthood and it's funding isn't about religion to me, it's about Fuck the Poor.

I'm not saying religion is the only (or even the most pressing) issue facing us, but yes, it does have a real and significant effect on the world.

If you want an example of stifled scientific research, stem cells.

Which will arrive sooner?

1. Advertising stops using sex appeal to get viewers' attention.

or

2. Next-generation stem cell treatments can make us all beautiful.

I'd predict [never] for the former, and 2025-2080 for the latter (depending on how you define it).

>> ^Enzoblue:

I so wanna be rich and good looking.


Becoming rich takes 5-25 years, depending on luck and starting position.

The people in this video are on the far right tail of the attractiveness bell curve, and for us to get there for most of the population... that will have to wait a few or several decades for reprogenetics & advanced cosmetic procedures (stem cell tech etc.).

In the meantime, most people can substantially improve their attractiveness through normal means (exercise, build a good personality, devote all of our life and intelligence to our careers, and so on).

>> ^xxovercastxx:

>> ^shinyblurry:


You have to ask yourself, if he's willing to lie about his education, what else is he willing to lie about?
I got about 10-15 minutes in and couldn't listen anymore. I like hearing a well-(in)formed counter-argument but this guy isn't even on a high school level of scientific understanding.


Not only that, but even in the first few MINUTES he already doesn't understand the very NATURE the way the brain interprets data and information. He's spending time talking about this important ability in humans yet leaves out ALL of psychology and neuroscience and what they have to say on the subject. Guess what they have to say? So he goes on and on talking about this WORTHLESS notion of design and doesn't understand that his brain is forcing him to BELIEVE this IS TRUE! All you have to ask him to disarm him is , "Why? Why does it look designed? Why?", then watch him splutter till his brain explodes, you know why, because due to psychology you BELIEVE it does, WITH BIAS--and it goes deeper too (much how you see optical illusions, why do those appear to be optical illusions? I don't know, why does that image appear to be designed?)--he will NEVER be able to answer that question, cause quite frankly he doesn't have the education obviously needed to do so.

His entire speech was over in the first few minutes, let alone ten to fifteen. Doctor my ass, "I" could lecture him into oblivion (as I'm sure a great many other people here could too).

This is why I've watched about three of shiny's video embeds (this being a semi-fourth as I only watched enough to know it was an epic failure). They all come from Christian based scientists that have credentials from said "Universities" or "Colleges" (next to public school, these are actually a step down in your learning experience) and are woefully unexperienced, have literal no knowledge IN THE FIELD they supposedly are talking about; or even worse they do terrible even IN the topics IN their field. This stuff works wonderfully for the religious media, religious politicians, the religious faithful, BUT you never see CERN, ITER, MIT, NASA, The Jet Propulsion Laboratory (NASA's JPL), and the various host of scientific federation teams and organizations working on ALL sorts of projects. They are never together because the other side only presents LARGE quantities BUNK "science" and BUNK or JUNK "scientific" videos. They are rightfully scorned by the media and the true scientific establishment.

You have to understand that the nature of what this man was saying in his video, like what @xxovercastxx said in his post, it's complete garbage. You can't even listen to the first minutes of it because he's already missing the boat. NO ONE except for fellow Christians will come out in support of this man's argument. There will be no "HOLY SHIT, HOW COULD WE NOT HAVE SEEN THIS" moment, because the man is an idiot. While shiny will think it's just bias and bigotry at work on the part of media and "THE WORLD'S SCIENTIFIC MINDS" (that's a lot of people shiny), they'll continue to build us useful things like planes, computers, fusion reactors (2018 for the first one), rockets, satellites, medicines, gene manipulation (already here)--->cures to genetic diseases (around the corner), cars, buildings, bridges, machines, new limbs (2030-40; stem-cell research could go FAR faster depending on how much we help), never dying (this one is tricky; some say 20!, I'd say more around 30-40 years out, BUT who gets it and what happens when we do get it--it could get scary), dams, should I go on i could list ALL night and never stop--scientists have done SO MUCH for us and still do. They are literally are best chance for a better future. People like the man in video are dangerous. They cause distrust and give mis-information about the greatest men and women that live on this Earth (other than those that are TRULY selfless souls, looking out for others always). People like that create a "rot" a disease in society; it's the "depression you feel in the air here in America. I point MY FINGER at them as the cause. They WILL NOT let progress nor happiness win, they are only concerned with what they "think", and what they "think" is not right.

What will these Christian scientists make, invent, or create for humanity, to help? Dams, cars, trains, light-bulbs--no...more videos to show scientists they're wrong... What did you get taught in school?

Proof there is no god.

Or that if one exists it doesn't give a fuck about minor things like humans.

Miracles are supposed to be great wonderful things.


Being born with no eyes isn't a miracle. Stop thanking Jesus for giving you such a "gift".


Now can we please get crackin' on stem cell research so we can get this kid some eyeballs.

It's a nice little bandaid, but it isn't a solution. It misses the point - which is the fact that being a paraplegic is sheer hell and an living out of an exoskeleton is demeaning. I'd rather see this money go into stem cell research.

When able bodied people see this kind of stuff they think "oh neat, looks like handicapped people are getting along just fine" and then go on with their day (I know this because I thought this way before I got hurt). Not walking isn't the half of it and something needs to be done to get the hundreds of thousands of (often young) sufferers better, not just mobile.

Tags for this video have been changed from 'michael fox parkinson stem cell research' to 'michael fox, parkinson, stem cell, research' - edited by jonny

So, after reading this nonsense, I had to respond.

1) If you "know JC" and "believe in Him", going out and murdering a
few dozen people should not allow access to Heaven. So, by not
murdering said people, you are in fact "earning" your way in by acting
within the guidelines of said religion which also include "knowing JC"
and "believing in Him". The notion that someone who is of sound mind
and practices a religion that can then go out and break all the
guidelines set by it and still get in via grace is no place I would
want to exist for eternity.

Matthew 7:21-23

“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.

On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’

And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’

Hebrews 10:26-27

For if we go on sinning deliberately after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, but a fearful expectation of judgment, and a fury of fire that will consume the adversaries.

Being a Christian isn't a free pass to sin. Anyone who is doing something like you described will never enter the Kingdom of Heaven.

2) If following God prevents mental illness (depression is a mental
illness), why does reading all of your commentary depress me so?
Shouldn't I feel better simply by reading all this nonsense? Plus I
think you should poll your fellow church goers to see how many are on
mood stabilizers or hit the bottle hard in the evenings. I don't
think strength = heavy drinking or pills.....or counseling or
therapy...or any other coping mechanism for that matter. I think
you'll find your list of people walking with the Lord is very small,
and that seems like they are forsaking him by their actions and
therefore would be denied entry into Heaven. It just doesn't make
sense for people to have to rely on external factors to stave off
depression if walking with Him prevents mental illness, so the only
other explanation is they are faking it.

1 Corinthians 1:18

For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.

2 Timothy 1:7

For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind.

No one is perfect and everyone has their speciai challenges but if someone is abusing medication and alcohol, they are definitely not following the Lord. Often times people have many areas in their life that they will not turn over to the Lord and they end up in situations like you're describing because of it. When you step out from under Gods protection you invite spiritual oppression into your life.

Atheists have a higher suicide rate. I argue this is because they
don't have the guidelines of a religion stating that suicide is a
unforgivable sin and that they are not fearful of missing out on
heaven/virgins/whatever. It's far too simple an answer to explain
away suicide as the forsaking of faith. But it's rather depressing to
know that your life has to remain shit because religious people hold
sway in many decisions that are contrary to scientific
evidence....preventing others from alleviating suffering. Stem cells,
certain drugs, scientific research, etc.

The problem is the evil that dwells in the hearts of men, which is universal and trancends all borders, boundaries, religions, creeds, races, and other human demarcations. To blame religion for all the evil in the world is to be looking at the symptom and not the cause.

It strikes me as supremely arrogant to assume that your will and wish
is the will of your deity, and that free will of others should be
suppressed because they aren't in lockstep with your beliefs.

It's not for my benefit that I tell you any of this, it is because I care about you and because the Lord commanded me to do so. I am telling you what Gods word says, not what I say.

I am not quoting you because you asked me to, although I think its pretty ridiculous to talk to someone you're ignoring and then tell them not to talk to you.

>> ^shinyblurry:

You can't earn your way into Heaven. We are saved by grace, which is unmerited favor. So, even if you did better works than 10 Mother Teresas, if you don't know Jesus Christ, you are still dead in your sins. It's only through Him that we are redeemed, and not by our works, but only our faith in Him is what justifies us.
If you're walking with the Lord then you are not going to commit suicide. The salvation of anyone doing so is in doubt. God gives us the strength to overcome, but when you walk away from Him you open yourself to spiritual oppression, which is where feelings of depression and suicide come from. So, anyone getting to that point had probably been walking away for awhile.

>> ^Porksandwich:
I wouldn't say Im an atheist, but I certainly don't follow any organized religions. I generally like logical answers, atheism usually has those when it comes to religion vs science discussions......but I also don't like people who say that all religions are 100% wrong. I like to think that all of them have a bit of truth to them, and people are too focused on the rest of the crap associated with it that the overall message is lost. Think of them as exaggerated stories, fairy tales, mythology.....just general stories that pass on a code of conduct and some lessons.
Now with that said. I have always wondered if the idea of suicide being a mortal sin is what keeps many religious followers from killing themselves as soon as they find the religion that gives them the best "deal". It's how terrorists operate, it's what nut jobs on the news use as an excuse to kill their kids and themselves.....to "save" them. I mean you are basically living your life by a set of commandments/codes/whatever and doing things to "earn" your way in. You live this life, for an eternal one.....but it seems like too many just look at the destination and ignore the journey. Kind of a, it sucks now and we can't do anything about it (we're being tested, it's a trial, it's our punishment, it's whatever), but eventually we'll get to <insert "heaven" equivalent here>.



I normally have you ignored, but apparently the site still sends emails when an ignored person quotes or mentions you (consider this a bug report to whomever I am supposed to report these to) and it also includes their text.

So, after reading this nonsense, I had to respond.

1) If you "know JC" and "believe in Him", going out and murdering a few dozen people should not allow access to Heaven. So, by not murdering said people, you are in fact "earning" your way in by acting within the guidelines of said religion which also include "knowing JC" and "believing in Him". The notion that someone who is of sound mind and practices a religion that can then go out and break all the guidelines set by it and still get in via grace is no place I would want to exist for eternity.

2) If following God prevents mental illness (depression is a mental illness), why does reading all of your commentary depress me so? Shouldn't I feel better simply by reading all this nonsense? Plus I think you should poll your fellow church goers to see how many are on mood stabilizers or hit the bottle hard in the evenings. I don't think strength = heavy drinking or pills.....or counseling or therapy...or any other coping mechanism for that matter. I think you'll find your list of people walking with the Lord is very small, and that seems like they are forsaking him by their actions and therefore would be denied entry into Heaven. It just doesn't make sense for people to have to rely on external factors to stave off depression if walking with Him prevents mental illness, so the only other explanation is they are faking it.

Atheists have a higher suicide rate. I argue this is because they don't have the guidelines of a religion stating that suicide is a unforgivable sin and that they are not fearful of missing out on heaven/virgins/whatever. It's far too simple an answer to explain away suicide as the forsaking of faith. But it's rather depressing to know that your life has to remain shit because religious people hold sway in many decisions that are contrary to scientific evidence....preventing others from alleviating suffering. Stem cells, certain drugs, scientific research, etc.

It strikes me as supremely arrogant to assume that your will and wish is the will of your deity, and that free will of others should be suppressed because they aren't in lockstep with your beliefs.

Please don't quote me or tag me if you respond to this, hopefully they'll fix the ignore function a little better in the future.

and still the religious nutjobs want to prevent stem cell research?!