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Chelsea Handler on Roe v. Wade Being Overturned

bobknight33 says...

Fifty years of liberal decisions and the left had no issue with the supreme court. Now the pendulum swings back and all hell breaks loose. The left are the radical side. This decision is just put the issue back to the states, where it belongs. About 1/3 of the states allow this murdering already

Still the most dangerous place for a child will still be the womb.


Like how Handler is unable to have an intelligent conversion about this topic just slanted jokes. That is all you can expect from an uneducated person with no college. No intelligent thought.


BSR (Member Profile)

The Chaotic Pendulum

Mordhaus (Member Profile)

The Check In: Betsy DeVos' Rollback of Civil Rights

newtboy says...

I wholeheartedly disagree. Those professions you mentioned require extensive knowledge of multiple disciplines and an ability to interact with other professionals, not a singular ability to preform one singular act. The criteria are varied and there is no one way to determine future performance based on any single test of abilities. Edit : Temperment, perceived social standing, manners, vocabulary, intelligence, education across the board, etc all matter in those professions, but not in basketball.

Yep, agreed, just pointing out that sports are not immune.

Those people are deluded. We don't live in a vacuum. People consider race, if only subconsciously, pretending we don't is just dishonest, and more often than not just an excuse to discriminate against others, if only by ignoring the extra obstacles they overcome to be equal.

MY policy would examine a person's entire situation, financial, local, familial, social, educational, employment, extra curricular activities, etc. and take it all into account when determining what kind of hard working student to admit. If admissions tests included all those and more in their decision, not just a single biased test result, race could be excluded unless diversity is required. Because diversity is required, both morally and legally, it would be good to start there and examine the results, then maybe race/gender could still be ignored, maybe not. We don't do that, so we can't know, but we do know the tests we use like SAT tests are biased and don't measure achievement, only specific wrote knowledge, which is a piss poor measure of a student's potential.

I think I understand your position, I do think it's important to not swing the pendulum of injustice harder in the other direction and instead work to stop it in the middle, I just disagree with your theories, your methodology, and I think you ignore many major factors and the desired/required result in order to stand immovable in your position.

When woman couldn't run in the Boston Marathon...she ran

Bruti79 says...

You asked me to explain why the "Equality Pendulum" wasn't anywhere close to the middle. I responded and asked you a question. The fact that you ignored all of that means you are either exceptionally dumb or a troll.

I'll just leave this question with you, answer it if you want, or not.

When in you're life has your gender, race, or sexual orientation ever held you back you from doing something?

If you want to have an actual conversation about equality in the world, answer that question. If you want to troll away, have at it.

In conclusion:

https://youtu.be/Qu8QiK7cBEY

You can do whatever you want. =)

newtboy said:

What does that have to do with being allowed to run in the 70's- today or with perpetuating sexual division in public marathons?
Nothing.
How many women alive today had to fight for their right to vote? How many of them run marathons?
I guess you support black only marathons too, then, right?

When woman couldn't run in the Boston Marathon...she ran

newtboy says...

Back when she started them, perhaps, but it still seems odd to me for HER to perpetuate the separate and unequal methodology that had worked so hard against her....different times....and I'm weird.

Today, as the article mentioned, there's not really good reason besides "girl power-female empowerment", which I find as distasteful as the idea of male only "boy power" races, which don't exist as far as I see outside of Iran.
Conversely, if little girls might need girl only racing to feel comfortable, why can't little boys feel the same and so get boy only races? Being ridiculed by girls for being a slow or odd runner hurts boys the same as the reverse hurts girls, no?
Most marathon finishers are women, they've proven they can and will run with men anywhere, but still today often men can't run with them.

Why does no one ever seem to want the pendulum of inequality to stop in the middle?

eric3579 said:

It seems there were good reasons to have women only races.
https://www.runnersworld.com/newswire/do-women-only-races-still-have-a-purpose

newtboy (Member Profile)

Jinx says...

I think it's an ugly necessity.

Equality isn't about treating everybody the same. I mean, I wish we could do that, but then I wish people wouldn't decide if they are going to hire somebody from their very first glance. But that's what we do. We do nothing and we simply allow our unconscious bias to rule our decision making which, in most cases, would be great for somebody like me.

I mean, I don't like it. I can understand entirely why people feel they have been cheated when somebody gets a job or promotion ahead of them just for the sake of ticking a diversity checkbox. Maybe you're right, maybe it is just adding energy to that pendulum, but then a pendulum without resistance swings forever. I hope conscious decisions to readdress imbalanced caused by unconscious bias works more as a dampening effect, as resistance.

Back to semantics. Like the woman in the video, I probably had quite a knee-jerk response to men's rights. Sometimes probably warranted, but then some feminists have some pretty dumb things to say as well. Anyway, the person that helped changed by mind about it was a woman and a feminist. Don't define a group by it's most extreme edges because I think it just leads you to make uncharitable judgements about people that identify as part of that group before you've even really listened to them.

newtboy said:

If you would ever advocate for a man's rights or against a woman's privilege, no, you would fail the feminist purity test, imo.

Absolutely, the label we use is less important than the actions we perform, but it's not meaningless.
Feminism is exactly as sexist as masculinism....but point taken.

Please note that affirmative action absolutely is racist, though. It divides people into races then treats the different races differently...the very definition of racism. I don't see how denying that fact accomplishes anything, it just sets up a future problem that mirrors the one you're working to solve. Ignoring that means you likely won't stop the pendulum swing at the center and we'll be right back where we started eventually.

A feminist comes to terms with the Men's Rights movement

newtboy says...

If you would ever advocate for a man's rights or against a woman's privilege, no, you would fail the feminist purity test, imo.

Absolutely, the label we use is less important than the actions we perform, but it's not meaningless.
Feminism is exactly as sexist as masculinism....but point taken.

Please note that affirmative action absolutely is racist, though. It divides people into races then treats the different races differently...the very definition of racism. I don't see how denying that fact accomplishes anything, it just sets up a future problem that mirrors the one you're working to solve. Ignoring that means you likely won't stop the pendulum swing at the center and we'll be right back where we started eventually.

Jinx said:

So I'm not a true feminist? I mean, I confess I wasn't born in Scotland but...

Semantics. I've argued them before.

I guess yes, feminism is as sexist as, say, affirmative action is racist. Making allowances for a disability, is, I suppose, a sort of discrimination too.

Anyway. What we call ourselves on the internet probably doesn't matter very much.

4 Revolutionary Riddles

L0cky says...

Where's the solutions goddammit.

My guesses:

1) a pendulum.
2) 3x faster (this one seems too simple)
3) in this case forwards, but depends on the weight of the bike, and friction between the ground and the tyres?
4) Q2 and 3 of every wheel.

Aftermath November 2016

enoch says...

*promote

i would like to say a few things.

first,
i would personally like to welcome my anti-war democrats back to the party.it appears it only took voting in the worlds most successful used car salesmen and professional internet troll to get you fuckers to get off the bench.

saved a seat for ya!../pats seat

second,
while i can admire this woman's passion and self righteous indignation,i refuse to accept her moral condescension,because for all her flowery and bombastic condemnation of anyone who voted for trump was a vote for:racism,sexism,bigotry and hatred,and implies she has deep understanding the motivations for voting trump.

i submit that she does not.
i submit that she is a hypocrite.

i submit that while she decries her anger and outrage at the moral ineptitude of her fellow americans for failing to rebuke an obviously unqualified candidate,who openly used racist and sexist rhetoric to appeal to our most base fears and anxieties.

she was missing the main point.the main reason.

so while she stood upon her ivory tower aghast at the horror unfolding in front of her on election night,she STILL did not get it.

she watched in horror as her fellow americans ignored trumps obvious racism.
ignored the sexism.
ignored the proto-fascist verbiage.
ignored the narcissism and petty tantrums.
ignored pretty much everything leading an election night into the surreal and absurd.

because she didn't get it,and obviously STILL doesn't get it.

because voting trump was not a vote for:racism,sexism,bigotry or hatred.
a vote for trump was a "fuck you" vote.
a trump vote was a "no confidence" vote.

now of course there are those who are racists,and sexist and are most certainly bigots and hateful fuckheads..of course.

and there are those who are diehard rightwing republicans...of course.

but the majority of those who voted trump are NOT those people.the majority of americans have..for forty fucking years..tried to utilize a system to counter correct the political establishment only to get fucked in the ass by the very same system they were trying to correct.

you can go look for yourselves.it looks like a clock pendulum.swinging dem and then back to repub and then back again.

and what did the american people get?
nothing.
nada.
zip.
zilch.

they got:
expanding wars.
stagnant wages and jobs.
higher taxes.
higher living costs.
drone strikes and secret prisons.
a two tiered justice system.
private prisons.
debt peonage.

and a government bought and paid for by:big banks,wall street,military industrial complex and multi-national corporations.

all this while the american middle class fell off the map into poverty and working poor.

so while those who voted trump may be politically unsophisticated,they are most certainly not dumb.

they got it.
and they finally understood that the system that they had been raised to believe was "by the people,for the people" no longer functioned at that capacity.

so the very same people who voted for obama and his "hope and change" campaign.
voted trump.
the people who had become politically engaged by the message that sanders brought to the table,either stayed home,or voted trump.

this was a protest vote.
plain and simple.

your fellow americans just nuked the system.
because it was the SYSTEM that was corrupt and no longer was functioning.

i find their choice just as terrifying as you do,but i have to admire the audacity to just nuke the entire system.

but can you really blame them?
they tried for decades to course correct,but the two party dictatorship had a stranglehold,and they served not 'we the people" but money and power.so our fellow americans utilized their one power given to them by the constitution.

and the hypocrisy here is that when bush was in office the left was losing their shit,and rightly so,but when obama was in office all we heard was crickets....and a disturbing silence from the left.(i realize this is an over generalization.there of course was some noise coming from the left).

and this woman is so out of touch that she is convinced that voting trump was a social issue matter?

i am sorry sweetheart,but some things are just not that simple,and condescending from your ivory tower,prattling on about social constructs as if you have been given some moral authority to judge others,only serves to solidify your own tiny and secluded echo chamber.where everybody can smell their own farts and pat themselves on the back for how clever they are,without ever having to critically examine ones own position.

which just means that she will never..ever..get it.

that is my .02 anyways.
take it for what it is worth.

176 Shocking Things Donald Trump Has Done This Election

notarobot says...

@newtboy: Trumps appeal to the LCD is successful mostly because the LCD has been allowed to grow so much in our post-Regan society. With inequality on the rise and decades of trickle-down government-by-the-wealthy-for-the-wealthy, those "left behind" have been growing faster and faster every year.

It Trump fails to win this go around then the pendulum may keep swinging further. My concern is that the next 'protest' candidate will be even worse than he.

@ChaosEngine:

We'll have to agree to disagree about some things. For me, as bad as Trump is, I'm not convinced that he is worse than what Hillary was revealted to be by the DNC Leaks...

...but perhaps instead of arguing about which shit sandwich is worse, it is more productive to work together to find out why there are only shit sandwiches on the menu?

On this:

"But things will never change until you fix your broken political system. You're barely a democracy these days."

I am in complete agreement.

When I first heard of the Brexit vote, I thought it was some nasty xenophobic/racist group that had somehow managed to capture 51% of a nation. But could Britian really be that full of xenophobes? It was in a bit of casual research on the subject when I discovered that J. Pie video I referenced in my earlier comment. I had to revise my first assumption about the group that voted to leave the E.U.. While there may have been an element of xenophobia involved, it was economic factors that was the driving force behind the Brexit vote.

People who have been screwed over by years of government for corporations which has only worsened since Glass–Steagall was repealed by Bill Clinton. The hold the wealthy have on government was tightened after Citizen's United.

Much of the support Trump has been able to marshal is a reaction to years of governance-for-the-wealthy-by-the-wealthy.

Lawrence Lessig's does a better job unpacking this quagmire in his talk: "We The People: the Republic We Must Reclaim" which has far too few views on YT or votes on the sift, IMO. For anyone who's ever been unhappy with the political system in the past number of years, I consider it a must-watch.


Link here:

http://videosift.com/video/lawrence-lessig-2016-will-have-two-elections-TED-talk

Rashida Jones coaches Stephen on how to be a Feminist

newtboy says...

No, if you believe in and work for gender equality FOR WOMEN, you're a feminist.
Those who believe in gender equality for all are called egalitarians.

Why 'feminism' is historically 'feminism' is because it works to secure the rights of women. Period. The feminist movement has never, as far as I know, worked against unequal rights for women when the inequality benefits women...or said another way, worked for equality FOR men.

It was not ONLY women at the start, only mostly women, and you disrespect and dismiss the contributions of all those men who worked against their own self interests to secure equal rights for you. How rude and ungrateful....I bet you would be upset if women's contributions to men's issues were dismissed like that.
No, men have not done the bulk of the work, but they have been invaluable in getting action many, many times. Calling it feminism and acting like it's only by women totally 'disacknowledges' all those self sacrificing men....which is why I have a problem. If we and our votes, money, and efforts don't count and are completely unapreciated, then buh-bye.
Again, no one is even suggesting renaming the entire movement, I suggested that people WHO THINK LIKE ME might start or join another that's more inclusive from the start. If you don't think like me, it's not about you, and even if you do, it's not a command, it's barely a suggestion.

If you focus solely on those with the MOST disadvantages, you only swing the pendulum of unfairness the other direction in a never ending struggle back and forth. Only by focusing on equality for all can you come to the right solutions to inequalities.

(Expletive deleted)! Men and whites ABSOLUTELY need equal rights. Yes, in MOST cases men and whites have advantages, not all by far like you said, still today a crackhead mother is more likely to get full custody than a fully employed stand up father...that is not the ONLY case where women are given advantages men aren't....another off the top of my head, domestic violence, men will ALWAYS be the one thought to be the aggressor without clear evidence to the contrary, but that's simply false, and leaves many abused men victimized twice. Same for sexual abuse/rape. Men get zero support if they've been raped, only ridicule and disbelief. Take each situation individually, or you'll continue to make that insulting, repulsive, self serving mistake that perpetuates inequality and pits men against women.

Equal child custody rights....yes, good example....how has the feminist movement worked to secure that....for men? If the imbalance is in their favor, that's FINE with feminists. I disagree strongly, and I won't be considering myself one anymore.

FlowersInHisHair said:

Don't overreact. If you believe in gender equality, you are a feminist.

As has been pointed out, and as you acknowledge, you were not there at the start of feminism. Why feminism is feminism is because the fight for gender equality was not initiated by men, nor has the bulk of the work been done by men. Calling it anything but feminism disacknowledges that women are the prime movers here. The fight for gender equality is the fight, spearheaded by women, to bring women's rights up to meet men's existing privilege level. It's feminism. You get credit for being part of the movement, but that's not enough reason to rename that movement, and I can't understand that argument.

Equality for all is the goal, yes. But to do this, women and non-whites are the ones who need the "boost". So that's why the movements are called "feminism", and "Black Lives Matter". Men and whites don't need "equal rights"; they already have more rights than non-white and women, aside from a few issues such as equal child custody rights, which will equalise when gender rights reach balance.

Acrobatics in the garage (Voltige)

Drachen_Jager says...

Third year?

Wow... in my third year of animation I knew how objects move.

Mind you, I'd been working professionally for 2 of those years.

This guy hasn't got a clue. Both the pendulum effect and the way objects move in the air is completely off. The pendulum is especially sad, since most 3d animation programs have a default movement curve which perfectly simulates that sort of motion.

Rashida Jones coaches Stephen on how to be a Feminist

newtboy says...

Would you expect white people who's children were killed by police to stand at the front of a 'black lives matter' event, or would you think they might not be there at all because the movement, by name and focus, ignores their 100% paralleling issues with police and makes them feel unwelcome?
I also think 'black lives matter' is losing out on a lot of support because they made it so racial, even if the target of MOST abuse is minorities. That is not the same as saying they can't call themselves that, or demeaning them for being part of the movement, or saying the movement is un-necessary, just that it's name is, to many, divisive, and that hurts them and their movement, and a more inclusive name for the movement would have been smarter, IMO.

I will say all my arguments apply equally to Masculisim/The men's rights movement, and while I might support many of their goals and might even work towards those goals, I would not call myself a part of that movement, as it by name ignores women's issues and focuses only on men's. Certainly those men's issues need attention, but that doesn't mean I should be so single mindedly focused on one part of equality that I put blinders on to better ignore other parts that also need work.

If the parenting issue had been solved by 'egalitarianists' the first time, there would likely have been joint custody, and fairly equal (1/2 with mom-1/2 with dad) full custody decrees LONG ago rather than have us continue to ride the pendulum, hitting 'fair' for an instant on each swing, then swinging back away from it.

Equality matters.
I think you don't ever get there by fighting for one side or the other. You get there by fighting for equality where ever that goal has yet to be reached.

You matter.
THAT would be the best, most inclusive name for a movement I've ever heard.

bareboards2 said:

@Babymech , that is one brilliant analogy.

Black lives matter.

NO NO NO, all lives matter!

What? Who was saying that all lives don't matter??!!!!

I'm going to use that in the future,

Because that is it. Right there.

To restate it in a way that @newtboy might approve:

Women's lives matter.

Men's lives matter.

Feminist = women's lives matter.

Men's Right Movement = men's lives matter.

The Constitution = all lives matter. (In a perfect world.)

PS There are separatist, angry nutters in the Men's Rights Movement. Doesn't mean that their goal is wrong in concept. An example of that is parental rights. What a pendulum swing that topic has gone through over the decades. First men own the children and women have no rights. Then it was women were blindly seen as the "best" to take care of the kids and men had no rights. And after legal pushback, there are plenty of joint custody agreements out there.

Women's lives matter. Yep.



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